Ha ha.

[futurebird.livejournal.com]

I remember back in 2002 when Abercrombie & Fitch put out some tee-shirts with a picture of two Asian men at the "Wongs Brothers Laundry Service" it read “Two Wongs Can Make It White.” other shirts had smiling men with slanted eyes wearing dorky-looking conical hats-- Some Asian-Americans and others said the shirts were stereotypical and racist. Then the predictable backlash began "it's just a joke, " said some "why are you so sensitive?" said others "I'm being suffocated by all of these rules about being PC!" and on and on.

There were also more sophisticated rationalizations for the racist tee shirts that went something like: "I have Asian friends, I don't feel any hatred to Asian people, I'm not racist, so why would you think I agree with something as racist as these tee-shirts? I don't. You see, it's just ironic, that someone as forward thing as me is wearing something so backwards." And then some people also pointed out that some Asian-Americans didn't think it was racist --so, really aren't the people who are complaining about it being overly sensitive, just looking for any excuse to get upset? The bottom line was that all of these rationalizations and explanations meant that it was still OK to wear the shirts even if some people thought it was racist "The only people who could be bothered and not get the joke are hyper-sensitive crybabies so, what's the big deal? Some Asian-Americans are even cool enough not NOT be offended. Why can't the ones who want to play PC police be more like those Asian-Americans?"

I remember being at a skiing team meet, our group instructor was about 20 years old, he was cute and a really good skier. I was 16 and had a bit of a crush on him. One day I ended up sharing a ski lift with him. I was excited to be sitting right next to him as we went up the mountian. Then, out of the blue, he says: "Do you ever tell racist jokes? It's OK, you know, if you make fun of everyone. Here's one: Why are black people so good at basketball?" I wanted to say I didn't like racist jokes, but he went on. "They know how to shoot, steal and hustle!" I tried to smile, but I didn't even really get the joke. My parents had always kept me very safe, and limited my exposure to movies and TV, so I didn't quite have the stereotype about black people being criminals on the top of my mind. But, I wanted to laugh at his joke! And then he said something like "See you're smiling. Ha ha. It is funny, ha ha admit it! You see things are much better if we can laugh about racism. It doesn't need to be such a big deal." I think I said "Yeah." even though I still didn't understand what he was saying. It took a day or so for it to sink in. Though even in that moment, suddenly, the ski lift felt like it was very very very high-up, and the air tasted very very very cold and I couldn't wait to get my feet back to the ground.

When I've had co-workes or other people I know say racist things I'm never prepared to confront them. Who wants to be the crabby one? You keep more friends by letting some things go. And maybe, it isn't such a big deal. --Some of the time people just don't know better. It's better if we can just laugh it away, right? If we laugh at everyone. (But, I think back, he never did tell a racist joke about white people. And if he expected me to tell one, I didn't know any.)

In fact, I still wonder: why did he bring up racism? I was the only black kid in our group. But nothing racist had happened. No one had even mentioned my race until that moment on the ski lift. When I think about it and other similar things that have happened, it doesn't seem like it was just a slip-up, but more like he was testing to see if I was one of "those" black people who gets angry about racism. You know those unreasonable people who get all bent out of shape if you show them picture of Sambo. The kind of black people who (outrageously) expect that white people should take their feelings in to consideration before, say, playfully using the n-word.

Part of growing up for me, has been drawing lines. I no longer stay friends with people who refuse to talk racism like adults, or with people who have no respect for my feelings. I can take a joke, but I won't put up with anything and everything simply to spare guys like that ski instructor from the uncomfortable feelings that comes along with being called racist. I don't need everyone to like me. If if anyone wants to dislike me for pointing out the racist things that they have said or done, before you try to scold me please consider the double standard implicit your defensiveness.

*feel the sarcasm.

Comments

[light-over-me.livejournal.com]

I think, perhaps, it's because there is some "crying wolf" going on in PC culture today, with things that really aren't intended as racist. So when it comes to more serious things like this which may actually be racist or prejudiced, unfortunately, some people lose sensitivity and assume you're being overly dramatic. I think that may have a lot to do with some of the backlash that occurs. In an effort to be totally PC in everything, we have lost some meaningful perspective about what it means.

To me, Politically Correct has always been about displaying mutual respect and tolerance, but it in my opinion it has been taken to the point where we're encouraging people to become offended and outraged over way too much. As a society, we also need to be able to deal with tolerating differing opinions.

[merig00.livejournal.com]

Yeap... I remember one guy went off because someone asked him "why do black people say aks instead of ask" Apparently asking that is racist.

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

It is.

[merig00.livejournal.com]

And why is it so?

Because 'black people' don't say ax

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

Because you're stereotyping based on race when its a particular cultural dialect. Not all black people belong to that particular culture. Therefore it is racist based on it being an untrue stereotype based on physical appearance.

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

Also, I guess I should add: The reason its racist, not just stereotyped is that I'm pretty certain people never see this cultural phenomenon in a positive light, so it's a negative stereotype based on physical appearance.

Its it important? Probably not too important, its not something I think they need to spend money making commercials for or anything, but in the question 'is it racist or is it not racist', yes, its a little racist.

[a-new-machine.livejournal.com]

1.) Classifies all black people by speech patterns of some.
2.) States that common "mispronunciations" (markers of an ethnic dialect), which the speaker ascribes to all black people, are somehow nonsensical or problematic.

Nobody asks why Southerners always say "y'all" and "reckon" and "vittles" and "drill baby drill."

[light-over-me.livejournal.com]

I wasn't even really thinking of race related issues. Silly things like banning people from saying "Merry Christmas" etc. That kind of stuff is frustrating to a lot of people, since it ends up being rather intolerant itself, and makes people feel like there's a double standard. Or people getting offended and outraged by song lyrics or video games.

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

Also, if you want to know the answer to your question(maybe you don't, but I find these things very fascinating):

http://www.randomhouse.com/wotd/index.pperl?date=19991216


It was actually an english, as in from England thing, and declined in popularity in the U.S. except for in the south. The reason it sounds weird for us is because lots of the black poor neighborhoods in places like L.A. are largely immigrants from the south U.S. who brought their dialects with them. They often still stay relatively culturally isolated from the 'mainstream' culture, often from a history of racism from where they're from and preserve and even further morph the dialect.

[merig00.livejournal.com]

I know... had to look it up myself several years ago when had a chemistry teacher who was from the South. I brought it up as an example because OP had a post on dialect this week.

[hannahsarah.livejournal.com]

Language is a powerful thing.

I'm three generations away from my family roots in Arkansas, and you can still hear my twang. My daughter is adopted, and she's picked up my twang too. When she started talking, I was asking my friends "Do I really sound like that?" and they said "Yes, she sounds exactly like you!", and my mom, and my grandma, and my great grandma...

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

Ah ha, my turn......

Saying that poor blacks in LA are from the south is because of the way they talk is such a stereotype. It has been 3 generations (60 years) since we've had a large influx of the south. My wife and b-i-l neither have any of their parent's, well, my b-i-l does say bafroom, and my wife says warsh, but neither my kids or nephews say either. One d-i-l has some southern inflections, but they are South American, and it's more of a second language thing :D)

[allhatnocattle.livejournal.com]

Overrecation prime example (http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=2740807) Not to forget how ventriloquism dummies oppress short people.

[gifa.livejournal.com]

So he corners a young girl in a place she is not free to walk away from, and proceeds to initiate an inappropriate conversation that he suspected might be wrong (otherwise why wait for a private moment)... and then just because that person didn't get angry with him, ask him to stop, or walk away he can either perceive that obviously, deep down, "all black people are ok with racist jokes", so he can go about his life feeling comfortable in knowing he's not really a racist because he laughs at and tells racist jokes. Not that reacting negatively would have done anything but reinforced the stereotype of his view of "black people" either. Geez...

Real fucking macho btw too... I'd be willing to wager my bank accounts, house, cars and potential lifetime income that this pussy would NOT have initiated this experiment in the company of a 20-30 year old African American male.

I don't necessarily think there's a problem with asking questions like this, because really, how are you going to know... right? But there's a place and time for it and a much more tactful way to do it. If he was sitting around with a bunch of his friends, a couple of whom were African American, and popped this question to the group with a straight face... instead of laughing at the joke he just told... that's one thing...

But the whole relationship balance between a 20 year old male and a 16 year old girl, an instructor/ student relationship, the Caucasian/ African Black/White thing, etc... and the predator/prey ambush timing and leading your response by modeling it for you is what makes that whole exchange uncool. I mean really... I just think that was an abuse of his power. I hope he secretly regrets doing that to you.

Just curious, because by virtue of some time and experience you are naturally more assertive now... If you could go back to that ski lift, and respond differently to his douche-baggery? What would your response be? Would you have corrected him?

A & F & Racism

[sophia-sadek.livejournal.com]

When you mentioned A & F in the context of a racist shirt, I was hoping you would touch on the topic of racism in the clothing retailer. I was first made aware of it when an African American girl pointed to the store and said that they don't hire black people. I ran into this book (http://www.amazon.com/Why-Hate-Abercrombie-Fitch-Sexuality/dp/0814756867/) at our local library. I haven't read the whole thing, but it has some interesting information on the whole A & F phenomenon.

Re: A & F & Racism

[futurebird.livejournal.com]

I did not know about that thanks for the link!

Re: A & F & Racism

[allhatnocattle.livejournal.com]

I've always wondered how saloons, nightclubs, etc can get away with only hiring hottie wait staff. But really, you don't see too many ugly chicks in public service anywhere. It's not good marketing to hire overweight zit-faced creepazoid. That's not racist, that's salesmanship.

Re: A & F & Racism

[dukexmachismo.livejournal.com]

As long as the hotties are racially diverse...


mmmmm racially diverse hotties.


I uh, have to go now.

Re: A & F & Racism

[belly78750.livejournal.com]

no it's misogyny, which is just as bad.

Re: A & F & Racism

[mrsilence.livejournal.com]

Err...how?

I mean that question sincerely, I really don't follow.

Re: A & F & Racism

[sophia-sadek.livejournal.com]

I prefer the saloons that hire chubby, dykey wait staff. They have more pizazz.

[dukexmachismo.livejournal.com]

Since most of the thread is now in tangent land, I'll just give my opinion that the guy in your example was a jerk, then go eat supper. ;)

[a-new-machine.livejournal.com]

I think the idea is that if you offend everybody, it's like offending no one. It's "edgy." I mean, after all, so long as you're willing to take your lumps/racist jokes, it's OK to insult other races! Turnabout is fair play in race relations, apparently. It's the Carlos Mencia school of equal opportunity ignorance. I for one still don't get it. Just because you have ignorant (in many cases, willfully ignorant) ideas about *every* race, you get off for being ignorant and offensive? I mean, the KKK hates pretty much everybody for one reason or another, but nobody says "Aw shucks, they're so broad-based in their racism, it's not like we can blame them for it!"

[allhatnocattle.livejournal.com]

I think this must be the one contribution Don Rickles to humanity. Anytime a reporter would accuse him of being racist, or crossing that fine line, Mr Warmth would say, "How can I be a racist? I hate everybody" which is funny coming from a short overweight balding Jew. Perhaps because he's a short overweight balding Jew. Perhaps because he was in Sinatra's Rat Pack he got away with it more.

[merig00.livejournal.com]