Ha ha.

[futurebird.livejournal.com]

I remember back in 2002 when Abercrombie & Fitch put out some tee-shirts with a picture of two Asian men at the "Wongs Brothers Laundry Service" it read “Two Wongs Can Make It White.” other shirts had smiling men with slanted eyes wearing dorky-looking conical hats-- Some Asian-Americans and others said the shirts were stereotypical and racist. Then the predictable backlash began "it's just a joke, " said some "why are you so sensitive?" said others "I'm being suffocated by all of these rules about being PC!" and on and on.

There were also more sophisticated rationalizations for the racist tee shirts that went something like: "I have Asian friends, I don't feel any hatred to Asian people, I'm not racist, so why would you think I agree with something as racist as these tee-shirts? I don't. You see, it's just ironic, that someone as forward thing as me is wearing something so backwards." And then some people also pointed out that some Asian-Americans didn't think it was racist --so, really aren't the people who are complaining about it being overly sensitive, just looking for any excuse to get upset? The bottom line was that all of these rationalizations and explanations meant that it was still OK to wear the shirts even if some people thought it was racist "The only people who could be bothered and not get the joke are hyper-sensitive crybabies so, what's the big deal? Some Asian-Americans are even cool enough not NOT be offended. Why can't the ones who want to play PC police be more like those Asian-Americans?"

I remember being at a skiing team meet, our group instructor was about 20 years old, he was cute and a really good skier. I was 16 and had a bit of a crush on him. One day I ended up sharing a ski lift with him. I was excited to be sitting right next to him as we went up the mountian. Then, out of the blue, he says: "Do you ever tell racist jokes? It's OK, you know, if you make fun of everyone. Here's one: Why are black people so good at basketball?" I wanted to say I didn't like racist jokes, but he went on. "They know how to shoot, steal and hustle!" I tried to smile, but I didn't even really get the joke. My parents had always kept me very safe, and limited my exposure to movies and TV, so I didn't quite have the stereotype about black people being criminals on the top of my mind. But, I wanted to laugh at his joke! And then he said something like "See you're smiling. Ha ha. It is funny, ha ha admit it! You see things are much better if we can laugh about racism. It doesn't need to be such a big deal." I think I said "Yeah." even though I still didn't understand what he was saying. It took a day or so for it to sink in. Though even in that moment, suddenly, the ski lift felt like it was very very very high-up, and the air tasted very very very cold and I couldn't wait to get my feet back to the ground.

When I've had co-workes or other people I know say racist things I'm never prepared to confront them. Who wants to be the crabby one? You keep more friends by letting some things go. And maybe, it isn't such a big deal. --Some of the time people just don't know better. It's better if we can just laugh it away, right? If we laugh at everyone. (But, I think back, he never did tell a racist joke about white people. And if he expected me to tell one, I didn't know any.)

In fact, I still wonder: why did he bring up racism? I was the only black kid in our group. But nothing racist had happened. No one had even mentioned my race until that moment on the ski lift. When I think about it and other similar things that have happened, it doesn't seem like it was just a slip-up, but more like he was testing to see if I was one of "those" black people who gets angry about racism. You know those unreasonable people who get all bent out of shape if you show them picture of Sambo. The kind of black people who (outrageously) expect that white people should take their feelings in to consideration before, say, playfully using the n-word.

Part of growing up for me, has been drawing lines. I no longer stay friends with people who refuse to talk racism like adults, or with people who have no respect for my feelings. I can take a joke, but I won't put up with anything and everything simply to spare guys like that ski instructor from the uncomfortable feelings that comes along with being called racist. I don't need everyone to like me. If if anyone wants to dislike me for pointing out the racist things that they have said or done, before you try to scold me please consider the double standard implicit your defensiveness.

*feel the sarcasm.

Comments

[light-over-me.livejournal.com]

I think, perhaps, it's because there is some "crying wolf" going on in PC culture today, with things that really aren't intended as racist. So when it comes to more serious things like this which may actually be racist or prejudiced, unfortunately, some people lose sensitivity and assume you're being overly dramatic. I think that may have a lot to do with some of the backlash that occurs. In an effort to be totally PC in everything, we have lost some meaningful perspective about what it means.

To me, Politically Correct has always been about displaying mutual respect and tolerance, but it in my opinion it has been taken to the point where we're encouraging people to become offended and outraged over way too much. As a society, we also need to be able to deal with tolerating differing opinions.

[merig00.livejournal.com]

Yeap... I remember one guy went off because someone asked him "why do black people say aks instead of ask" Apparently asking that is racist.

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

It is.

[merig00.livejournal.com]

And why is it so?

[light-over-me.livejournal.com]

I wasn't even really thinking of race related issues. Silly things like banning people from saying "Merry Christmas" etc. That kind of stuff is frustrating to a lot of people, since it ends up being rather intolerant itself, and makes people feel like there's a double standard. Or people getting offended and outraged by song lyrics or video games.

Because 'black people' don't say ax

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

Because you're stereotyping based on race when its a particular cultural dialect. Not all black people belong to that particular culture. Therefore it is racist based on it being an untrue stereotype based on physical appearance.

Re: Because 'black people' don't say ax

[merig00.livejournal.com]

So if it was "some black people" it would have been alright?

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

Also, I guess I should add: The reason its racist, not just stereotyped is that I'm pretty certain people never see this cultural phenomenon in a positive light, so it's a negative stereotype based on physical appearance.

Its it important? Probably not too important, its not something I think they need to spend money making commercials for or anything, but in the question 'is it racist or is it not racist', yes, its a little racist.

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

Yes.

[a-new-machine.livejournal.com]

1.) Classifies all black people by speech patterns of some.
2.) States that common "mispronunciations" (markers of an ethnic dialect), which the speaker ascribes to all black people, are somehow nonsensical or problematic.

Nobody asks why Southerners always say "y'all" and "reckon" and "vittles" and "drill baby drill."

[light-over-me.livejournal.com]

The reason its racist, not just stereotyped is that I'm pretty certain people never see this cultural phenomenon in a positive light

It depends on the context and situation, I suppose. I understand some people feel there is a negative stereotype attached to it, and that may be true, but if you approach everyone the same way as if they mean something bad by it, then you miss an opportunity to educate, and end up feeding into the idea that there is something negative about it-- which there isn't at all. Sometimes people do ask things which come across as naive, but are genuinely just curious. Of course, if they say it with an attitude and don't really care about the answer, then by all means tell them to bugger off.

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

Why do white people say y'all vs why do some white people say y'all

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

I'm pretty sure the person who asked 'why do black people say...' wasn't thinking of it as a positive attribute, lets just say that.

[merig00.livejournal.com]

Why do all white people say y'all vs why do white people say y'all

[light-over-me.livejournal.com]

Nobody asks why Southerners always say "y'all" and "reckon" and "vittles" and "drill baby drill."

Actually, I live in New England, and I do hear that sort of thing... even within New England, there are comments made about the different accents here. It isn't really an uncommon thing.

[merig00.livejournal.com]

What's with negative thinking? Goes back to light_over_me point...

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

Also, if you want to know the answer to your question(maybe you don't, but I find these things very fascinating):

http://www.randomhouse.com/wotd/index.pperl?date=19991216


It was actually an english, as in from England thing, and declined in popularity in the U.S. except for in the south. The reason it sounds weird for us is because lots of the black poor neighborhoods in places like L.A. are largely immigrants from the south U.S. who brought their dialects with them. They often still stay relatively culturally isolated from the 'mainstream' culture, often from a history of racism from where they're from and preserve and even further morph the dialect.

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

What are you talking about?

[merig00.livejournal.com]

I know... had to look it up myself several years ago when had a chemistry teacher who was from the South. I brought it up as an example because OP had a post on dialect this week.

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

I assume from this what you are implying is that 'why do white people say' indicates 'why do some white people say' and I'm pretty certain in stating that it does not, and is more often interpreted to mean 'why do people who are white, as in any person with caucasian european appearance'

[merig00.livejournal.com]

this:

I'm pretty sure the person who asked 'why do black people say...' wasn't thinking of it as a positive attribute, lets just say that.

Right away you thought that the person wasn't genuinely curious

[light-over-me.livejournal.com]

Well unless you were there, you're kinda assuming that. Yeah, they could have fluffed out their language and said "what is the cultural origin of that particular dialect that some black people use..." but then he might have ended up sounding stilted and superficial. On the other hand, if these people were friendly, and he didn't say it in a provocative way...then chances are his friend might have understood what he meant and what his intentions were.

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

I didn't say he wasn't genuinely curious, I said that he views saying 'axe' as a negative attribute.

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

I'd rather be stilted and superficial than stereotyping needlessly, but that's just me. There's a million ways to indicate that he was talking about a certain segment instead of people with african race in general though.

[light-over-me.livejournal.com]

Well, then I guess I just see it differently. I could be biased, because I'm interested in languages and I would genuinely find the answer interesting. I have friends from foreign countries who innocently ask me questions about why "white people do this" or why "Americans do that...", but unless they have an attitude or are obviously being rude, I don't assume they mean anything by it. Ignorance isn't always a reflection of prejudice. On the other hand, if they were to come and ask me why all white people "have big noses" then yea, I'd be offended.