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talkpoliticsIt has been said that the people in the Western World should just keep out of developing nations, that
the era of ' the White Man's Burden' is over, and we can never correct the mistakes of the past ourselves.
So, what are we to do about the situation that we see on our TV screens, I ask?
I know there are some that say 'Just accept the fact that you are privileged - there is nothing you can do for the poor in developing countries'.
Oh , yeah? How about ...
Amnesty International. do you realise that Amnesty is over 50 yrs old, and has freed many people from detention around the world? It has supported the peaceful struggle for democratic representation and is currently still fighting the corner for Aung San Su Ky and for Democracy in Burma.
The Fair Fair Trade Foundation.
By setting up workers co operatives with people in the developing world, it enables people in those countries to grow food and earn more money than they would by working on a plantation run by Nestle or any other traditional corporation.
The Grameen Bank.
By supplying micro credit to people in the third world, mostly women , they enable people to start businesses and make income of their own .
Trade Justice.
The world's poor take their goods to market. but the tariffs, quotas, commodity prices and such are all set out by the World Trade Organisation, that meets in New York. The UK can afford to send many delegates to the USA to argue their case and speak up for them and their industries. Sadly, the people of Ghana cannot afford to send anyone. like many developing nations, their voice is never heard at the trade conferences were decisions involving them get made.
So, I think that we ought to be supporting these causes and organisations as individuals and as national communities.
the Mises Institute has said that the Fair trade movement is 'distorting the market', yet I don't hear Mises complain when the US government subsidises the American Cotton growing corporations and allows them to dump subsidised cotton on the world market that kills local competition in developing countries stone dead.
The Mises Institute doesn't mind an easy ride for the rich it seems , but wants to discourage us from helping the poor.
But anyway - how can anyone complain about the activities of these organisations in the developing world?
What do local people say about them? What alternatives are there that right wingers and other critics would put up ?
The free market, did someone say?
the free market gave us Nestle - which prompted the Nestle Boycott.
the Free Market led to the backlash that prompted the rise of Socialism in Britain .
lets remember that the people of the Soviet bloc who risked their lives to cross the Berlin Wall were not heading for a free market, but rather the regulated markets and mixed economies of democratic Western Europe.
in the last 50 years, the NGOs like Amnesty International and the Fair Trade Foundation have done a great deal to develop a higher standard of living in the poorer nations of the world. free trade , by contrast, has gone in and marketed tobacco in Africa in order to make easier profits - marketing and advertising regulations have lower standards than the UK and USA, and tobacco corporations are quick to take advantage and go for easy profits here. I feel it's the corporations that represent the new Imperialism , and not the NGOs like Amnesty International.
the era of ' the White Man's Burden' is over, and we can never correct the mistakes of the past ourselves.
So, what are we to do about the situation that we see on our TV screens, I ask?
I know there are some that say 'Just accept the fact that you are privileged - there is nothing you can do for the poor in developing countries'.
Oh , yeah? How about ...
Amnesty International. do you realise that Amnesty is over 50 yrs old, and has freed many people from detention around the world? It has supported the peaceful struggle for democratic representation and is currently still fighting the corner for Aung San Su Ky and for Democracy in Burma.
The Fair Fair Trade Foundation.
By setting up workers co operatives with people in the developing world, it enables people in those countries to grow food and earn more money than they would by working on a plantation run by Nestle or any other traditional corporation.
The Grameen Bank.
By supplying micro credit to people in the third world, mostly women , they enable people to start businesses and make income of their own .
Trade Justice.
The world's poor take their goods to market. but the tariffs, quotas, commodity prices and such are all set out by the World Trade Organisation, that meets in New York. The UK can afford to send many delegates to the USA to argue their case and speak up for them and their industries. Sadly, the people of Ghana cannot afford to send anyone. like many developing nations, their voice is never heard at the trade conferences were decisions involving them get made.
So, I think that we ought to be supporting these causes and organisations as individuals and as national communities.
the Mises Institute has said that the Fair trade movement is 'distorting the market', yet I don't hear Mises complain when the US government subsidises the American Cotton growing corporations and allows them to dump subsidised cotton on the world market that kills local competition in developing countries stone dead.
The Mises Institute doesn't mind an easy ride for the rich it seems , but wants to discourage us from helping the poor.
But anyway - how can anyone complain about the activities of these organisations in the developing world?
What do local people say about them? What alternatives are there that right wingers and other critics would put up ?
The free market, did someone say?
the free market gave us Nestle - which prompted the Nestle Boycott.
the Free Market led to the backlash that prompted the rise of Socialism in Britain .
lets remember that the people of the Soviet bloc who risked their lives to cross the Berlin Wall were not heading for a free market, but rather the regulated markets and mixed economies of democratic Western Europe.
in the last 50 years, the NGOs like Amnesty International and the Fair Trade Foundation have done a great deal to develop a higher standard of living in the poorer nations of the world. free trade , by contrast, has gone in and marketed tobacco in Africa in order to make easier profits - marketing and advertising regulations have lower standards than the UK and USA, and tobacco corporations are quick to take advantage and go for easy profits here. I feel it's the corporations that represent the new Imperialism , and not the NGOs like Amnesty International.
(no subject)
Date: 18/7/11 15:55 (UTC)Amnesty International does absolutely nothing to help the poor but they do a lot of good work to advance the cause of freedom, however they also waste quite a bit of effort trying to equate terrorists and other criminals with political prisoners. I don't care how just your cause, when you blow up a school you deserve to be punished.
"The Fair Fair Trade Foundation.
By setting up workers co operatives with people in the developing world, it enables people in those countries to grow food and earn more money than they would by working on a plantation run by Nestle or any other traditional corporation."
I'm rather neutral to the whole Fair Trade thing because I think it's benefits are massively overblown. It simply will not scale and so while it helps a handful of individual farmers doesn't really do anything to alleviate poverty in those countries on a larger scale. That said some of the best single source chocolate comes from fair trade sources and I have no qualms whatsoever spending a few extra bucks to get them.
"The Grameen Bank.
By supplying micro credit to people in the third world, mostly women , they enable people to start businesses and make income of their own ."
I don't know anything about this particular agency but I love the idea of micro credit and see it as a perfect libertarian solution to helping the poor in 3rd world countries, however even here the benefit is largely overstated because the entire concept is based on the flawed idea that most poor people will make excellent entrepreneurs.
"Trade Justice.
The world's poor take their goods to market. but the tariffs, quotas, commodity prices and such are all set out by the World Trade Organisation, that meets in New York. The UK can afford to send many delegates to the USA to argue their case and speak up for them and their industries. Sadly, the people of Ghana cannot afford to send anyone. like many developing nations, their voice is never heard at the trade conferences were decisions involving them get made."
Is this an actual organization or just an ideal? If it is an organization what do they do, if it is an ideal then hey welcome to the free trade club. Not that managed trade crap they peddle at the WTO and call free trade but actual free trade with no barriers, quota's, or Tarrifs whatsoever. This is afterall the most libertarian of positions.
(no subject)
Date: 18/7/11 16:29 (UTC)By supporting people campaigning for union recognition and the democratic right to vote, they are in fact helping poor people who need these things.
If you can vote , you can help elect governments that will provide legislation protecting workers from exploitation.
The work of AI is linked exclusively to people involved in non violent protest.I don't know of any terrorist organisation that Amnesty has ever supported.
It simply will not scale and so while it helps a handful of individual farmers doesn't really do anything to alleviate poverty in those countries on a larger scale.
it helps some and needs to grow bigger.the fac that it is still trading means that it can incorporate more products into its range and employ even more workers. it is a way forward for workers to own and manage the means of production themselves.
however even here the benefit is largely overstated because the entire concept is based on the flawed idea that most poor people will make excellent entrepreneurs. In spite of the fact that this company's founder won a Nobel prize for his work, the Grameen bank has not spread beyond Bangladesh , the place it was founded. but the concept of microc redit has enabled its expansion.
It does not mean that every poor person needs entreprenuerial skills. So long as the work in a co operative, the people in charge run things and the workers just keep on working as usual.
Trade Justice is an ideal, but the organisations that support it include World Development Movement, War on Want, Fair Trade Council and many others. It is opposed to the way in which the WTO tends to operate. Trade Justice advocates a de coupling of farming subsidies - if EU governments want to keep people on the land, we say that instead of 'coupling' - paying a subsidy on a particular crop, it should be de coupled. The farmer gets an allowance for keeping his acres under cultivation. This allows the farmer to switch production in response to market prices and prevents the over production that coupling causes.
(no subject)
Date: 18/7/11 16:52 (UTC)http://www.hudson-ny.org/1167/amnesty-international-whitewashes-terrorism-suspends-whistleblower
http://www.investigativeproject.org/1890/amnesty-international-boss-endorses-jihad-in-self
And there are arguably others around the world going back all the way to the groups founding, but where the question of whether the individual in question really counts as a terrorist is a matter of intrepretation.
(no subject)
Date: 21/7/11 04:36 (UTC)The second and third suggests that AI is damaged because it is trying to stop the US from torturing people. I don't see how this falls out with the MO of AI, but it seems pretty legit to me. I get your point that if you blow up a school you should be punished, but should you also be tortured? I think it's a storm in a teacup trying to discredit AI (not sure why, but it's a lefty organisation so I guess that's enough). Do you really think people don't have the right to fight back when their country is invaded?