Unnecessary shutdowns

[gunslnger.livejournal.com]

The federal government is shutting down a lot of things that are either don't need to be shut down (because they cost no money to operate) or actually cost more to shut down than they do to keep operating. These include both national parks and government agency websites.

http://www.ijreview.com/2013/10/84362-13-national-parks-impacted-government-shutdown/
http://reason.com/blog/2013/10/02/government-will-shut-down-websites-even

We're at the point where the government is just being petty and working on zooming well past that point.

For those who think it's justified because the Republicans won't budge on Obamacare, that just doesn't fit the facts.



As a libertarian, I'm fine with permanently cutting 800,000 federal workers and I think it's nice that they've identified the agencies we can do without, but I'd rather it happen with at least the standard 2-week warning for people. Pretty much all politicians in office right now are acting like children, but that's what happens when the electorate is also.

Comments

[fizzyland.livejournal.com]

Everything requires maintenance - sidewalks with gates, roads under federal jurisdiction, government servers. When you send everyone home who does those jobs, it isn't responsible to just leave the gates open and let whatever happen.

[aviv-b.livejournal.com]

No, see the magic lolotarian unicorns will cut the grass and fix the broken sidewalks, provide crowd control, and in this age of terrorism, provide security.

[gunslnger.livejournal.com]

The sidewalk will degrade to nothing in a few days without constant attention, is that it?

[fizzyland.livejournal.com]

If there was nothing but sidewalk there would be no concern but instead there's an actual memorial that sits on property. Should parks and monuments just be left open and unsupervised?

[kylinrouge.livejournal.com]

Libertarians don't care what happens as long as they're not personally inconvenienced.

[fizzyland.livejournal.com]

In that case, I'm going to get my chisels and spray paint and make some modifications.

[cheezyfish.livejournal.com]

Maybe the guards who sit there to make sure no one gets in could supervise it? Or they could do what they did before the shutdown, and you know, not have anyone supervising.

[paft.livejournal.com]

Do you really not understand the difference between a security guard and someone who actually understands how to maintain a monument, pavements, lawns, scuptures, etc.?

[cheezyfish.livejournal.com]

The maintenance on a monument will require maintenance whether people are allowed in or not. The maintenance on a sidewalk and sculptures are long term things anyways, and people don't really have an impact. Weather does. The only problem would be trash, but then again we aren't exactly evacuating D.C. and putting barricades up around the city either are we? Regardless, it would be cheaper to have someone come once a week to pick up the trash than to pay park rangers to make sure no one enters the park, rangers that weren't required when the park was open. There are some parks that would have to be closed, like pearl harbor, yellowstone, etc. But places like the WW2 and Vietnam memorial, which are open 24/7 anyways, closing them cost more than it does to keep them open.

[paft.livejournal.com]

ch: The maintenance on a sidewalk and sculptures are long term things anyways, and people don't really have an impact.

Of course they have an impact. People climb on the sculptures, write things on them, throw things at them. And yes, people do have a impact on sidewalks. They don't just walk on sidewalks. Wheelchairs and carts are used on them, and vehicles are occasionally driven on them.

ch: Regardless, it would be cheaper to have someone come once a week to pick up the trash than to pay park rangers to make sure no one enters the park, rangers that weren't required when the park was open.

What makes you think park rangers aren't required when the park is open? And maintaining a park involves much, much more than someone coming in once a week to pick up trash.

What experience do you have in park and monument maintainance? I ask because, while I myself have none, I do know enough about gardening, landscaping, and the care of statues and pavements, to know that maintenance and protection of these amenities are not as simple as you seem to believe.

[jerseycajun.livejournal.com]

In the duration this farce is likely to cover, what do you foresee happening if it was left open? Especially in the case of the grounds around these monuments (Washington, Vietnam, etc).

I'm imagining underground societies secretly coordinating with one another just waiting for the day a shutdown happens so they can deface them some monuments, and letting out a collective "hallelujah! Our time has finally arrived. Let us go do that voodoo that we do so well!!!" when the news came down.

Sounds like the foundation for an absurdist comedy sketch.

[notmrgarrison.livejournal.com]

There was actually someone defacing the monuments fairly recently, though that was before the shutdown.

Edit: Oops. We got in a minor tiff last time. I'm not continuing. I just thought it was funny because it actually did happen, when there was no shutdown. Though I believe they determined it was just one person doing it.

[telemann.livejournal.com]

I'm imagining underground societies secretly coordinating with one another just waiting for the day a shutdown happens so they can deface them some monuments

Just a few months ago. So it has happened, recently.

[rimpala.livejournal.com]

I can actually see a group of White Supremacists wanting to deface the Lincoln Memorial to make a statement.

[jerseycajun.livejournal.com]

Point taken.

That said, do you think the government shutdown is going to cause a measurable uptick in such instances? In other words, would there be any measurable difference in effect, given that we have established via photo that this kind of thing happens whether or not a shutdown is ongoing.

[paft.livejournal.com]

It's fascinating to watch the way you guys attempt to frame common sense precautions (like, "national monuments need to be protected from vandalism") as if they were elaborate conspiracy theories.

[jerseycajun.livejournal.com]

Imagining a hyperbolic comedic take on what the shutdown via cordoning off monuments inside or out means, for the sake of a little self-amusement, is not positing a conspiracy theory.

[luzribeiro.livejournal.com]

At what point does that become an issue? 7 days? A month? Two months?

[kylinrouge.livejournal.com]

It won't be long until private charities step in to maintain it.

Or maybe corporations will and they'll charge us a fee to walk on it.

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

Strangely enough there are a number of local monuments and sites that are maintained by private "charities" or more accurately historical societies.

[kylinrouge.livejournal.com]

A bit different from a sidewalk, eh?

[mylaptopisevil.livejournal.com]

And what happens if/when those historical societies decide to not do it anymore? Or if they decide to rewrite the historical context of what they're maintaining? Or if they decide to provide naming writes to the largest corporate grant/individual donation/etc?

[cheezyfish.livejournal.com]

Ummm, a sidewalk? Maybe a decade or three.

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

Dude, you are just not taking sidewalks seriously enough.

[cheezyfish.livejournal.com]

I know... what if like, a root grew and cracked it and there was no employees there to put a orange cone on it. Shut that shit down before it's to late.