[identity profile] sandwichwarrior.livejournal.com posting in [community profile] talkpolitics
One death is a tragedy; a million deaths are a statistic.
-Iosif Vissarionovich Dzhugashvili (AKA Joseph Stalin)



Uncle Joe may have been a cold-hearted mass murderer but he knew something of human nature.

Truth is that we simply don't handle the notion of shared sacrifice well. Be it ten casualties or ten million our understanding of conflicts is often nothing more than a handful of digits. It is abstract. As Stalin would say, it's a statistic. As a result Memorial Day has become less rememberance of shared sacrifices and more about grilling burgers and steaks. And yet to some of us it is intensely personal, It's our father, son, daughter, husband, wife, lover, or friend who will never again darken a doorway or share drink. It isn't a statistic, it's a tragedy.


To every Soldier, Sailor, Guardsman, Airman, and Marine, to those who were disposable and disposed of, to the friends we left behind, and to our enemies, this is your day.

Happy Memorial Day.







(With Special thanks to Borepatch and Panookah who's posts I am blatantly ripping off)

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 05:32 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] allhatnocattle.livejournal.com
As every religion teaches so well....Sacrifice Is The Greatest Glory

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 05:58 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] meus-ovatio.livejournal.com
Your image is fucking with my screen width. Damn yous. Put this under a cut, so the non-Americans don't get angsty.

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 07:51 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] deborahkla.livejournal.com
Just out of curiousity, what are the total numbers for World Wars I & II, and why aren't they included?

Memorial Day means so little to so many people in the USA today because we're so removed from the realities of war. As someone who grew up with combat footage from Viet Nam on the evening news every night, I can promise you that if the actual combat action in the wars in both Iraq and Afghanistan were broadcast every night, they would have been over long ago. That relentless, nightly television footage was one of factors that contributed to the end of the warin Viet Nam, because it turned the people against the war.

Unfortunately, it's the Pentagon's job to keep wars going without being met with criticism, so they made damn sure that the same coverage wouldn't be allowed for either Iran or Iraq. For the generals, it's job security to keep young men and women in battle.

The best way to remember the sacrifices made in previous wars would be to bring our men and women home from Iraq and Afghanistan. If only that could happen on Memorial Day.
Edited Date: 30/5/11 07:52 (UTC)

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 11:48 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com
World War I killed some 10 million soldiers, but was followed by an influenza epidemic which killed more than the actual war did, but was also caused by the stresses of the war.

World War II killed some 50 million people. Depending on when the date's set that number only goes up.

I might note also that the bloodiest war in history before either was not on the list itself, and that would be the Taiping Rebellion of 1850-1864 which at a minimum caused the death of 20 million people, putting it over all other wars combined until WWII.

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 13:25 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] deborahkla.livejournal.com
Thanks very much for the information! :-)

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 22:14 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] dreadfulpenny81.livejournal.com
Memorial Day means so little to so many people in the USA today...

I disagree with this. From what I've seen today, there's so many people who took the time to voice appreciation for military members and their families, as well as the civilians who do service for the military. I don't expect everyone to throw a parade for soldiers, but a simple THANK YOU is sufficient as long as it's sincere.

The best way to remember the sacrifices made in previous wars would be to bring our men and women home from Iraq and Afghanistan. If only that could happen on Memorial Day.

Yes, maybe next year.

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 10:09 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] root-fu.livejournal.com
Looks like a darker, edgier, Twilight advertisement.

I don't understand grievances on these issues. Given the lack of (preventionism > reactionism), there certainly doesn't seem to be any unified effort to prevent circumstances which lead to these negative consequences.

Its like Chernobyl and Fukushima. Everyone complains, but no one seems to care enough to identify circumstances which lead to these disasters much less prevent them.

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 12:20 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pluckedflowers.livejournal.com
"Everyone complains, but no one seems to care enough to identify circumstances which lead to these disasters much less prevent them."

Actually, there are plenty of people who have engaged in this kind of analysis in these strange places called universities.

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 14:29 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pluckedflowers.livejournal.com
"Universities. LOL"

Yes, that seems to be the prevailing attitude. Hence the failure to actually solve any of the pressing problems of the day.

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 14:41 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] root-fu.livejournal.com
Universities in general have strong R & D ties to the corporate sector. For profit universities have strong ties to the investment sector. This creates a bias towards profits and profit centric enterprise.

In an era rife with war profiteering, educational (monetary) exploitation, health care exploitation, anti-terrorism profiteering. Is it logical to assume universities with a profit centric bias will do anything to prevent war, improve healthcare, make education more affordable -- or do anything to help people in general and therefore lower profit margins?

Probably not. d:

I wonder what it is you think universities are "doing" exactly.

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 14:51 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pluckedflowers.livejournal.com
You're certainly right about the unfortunate ties between universities and capitalist interests, but these have not yet undermined their ability to function as a forum for objective academic inquiry. This doesn't mean they always actually do fulfill this function, but they still do enough to merit critical attention.

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 14:58 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] root-fu.livejournal.com
Hm. ok. (:

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 22:32 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] anfalicious.livejournal.com
Are you seriously discounting all knowledge that comes out of universities?

See this is why you believe crazy things.

(no subject)

Date: 31/5/11 10:12 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] root-fu.livejournal.com
Things look crazy when you fail to understand what a corporate bias, is.

Someone hasn't used Google:

Date: 30/5/11 12:35 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com
http://www.amazon.com/Dark-Side-Democracy-Explaining-Cleansing/dp/0521538548

http://www.amazon.com/Blood-Soil-History-Genocide-Extermination/dp/0300100981

Re: Someone hasn't used Google:

Date: 30/5/11 14:03 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] root-fu.livejournal.com
The first book only has 3 customer reviews. The second has 9.

If you're attempting to show there is a huge demand for books which focus on preventionism in terms of addressing negative circumstances which lead to disasters, I think you may want to question your approach. [:

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 10:39 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] madjacktech.livejournal.com
Ripped from someone else's blog or not, still very well put.
And this Desert Storm vet thanks you for posting it.

Here's to our fallen comrades. May we never forget.



(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 20:31 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com
Just one counterpoint-the quote is apocryphal and was never actually said by Stalin. It's a sentiment rather typical of Mr. Glorified Bank Robber but he at no point actually *said* that statement.

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 12:03 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] blue-mangos.livejournal.com
So many lives lost in conflict, all someone's loved ones, all vitally important to those around them. May we never forget them and always appreciate the sacrifices made, regardless of our views on the conflicts themselves.

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 12:35 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] lai-choi-san.livejournal.com
Sorry, this pic... I don't understand its purpose. 38 000 000 deaths only ? Just considering, an example among others, the 60 000 000 people killed during WW2 ? One has to believe that many ingredients are kept in the dresser.

(no subject)

Date: 31/5/11 11:19 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] lai-choi-san.livejournal.com
So basically, the target is the people who only read the headlines. It makes sense now. Thanks for the explanation. :)

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 19:00 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] paft.livejournal.com
Indeed. Stalin knew that reducing human consequences to numbers is a good way of anesthetizing oneself while defending indefensibly inhumane policies.

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 20:38 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com
But his preferred method was shooting people who complained in the back of the head and trying the ones it was expedient to do that to with propaganda purposes and *then* shooting them in the back of the head. All of which was Leninism on 'roids.

It was actually *Germany* that did a lot more of that "police action" nonsense.

(no subject)

Date: 31/5/11 02:21 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] terminator44.livejournal.com
This phenomenon is explained in more detail in Words and Behavior (http://danassays.wordpress.com/collected-essays-by-aldous-huxley/aldous-huxley-essays-words-and-behavior/) by Aldous Huxley.

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 21:54 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] devil-ad-vocate.livejournal.com
Remembering my friend Robert Whiteside, U.S. Navy, 1944-1969.

(no subject)

Date: 30/5/11 22:32 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] dukexmachismo.livejournal.com
Truth is that we simply don't handle the notion of shared sacrifice well. Be it ten casualties or ten million our understanding of conflicts is often nothing more than a handful of digits. It is abstract. As Stalin would say, it's a statistic. As a result Memorial Day has become less rememberance of shared sacrifices and more about grilling burgers and steaks. And yet to some of us it is intensely personal, It's our father, son, daughter, husband, wife, lover, or friend who will never again darken a doorway or share drink.

I think we have good reason to be ambivalent about Memorial Day. On the one hand, I personally believe there is, indeed honor, in making sacrifice for one's nation. But then, the nation of which you and I are citizens has often abused that sacrifice, sending young people off to fight for what ultimately boils down to corporate interest or paranoid imperialism.

So... today, I do give honor to those who gave greatly for what they felt was their country's need, but I also have a mighty FUCK YOU IN THE ASS for the recruiters who lied to them, the politicians who sent them to far away places to do ugly things for bad reasons, then failed to support them, and the VA bureaucrats who screwed them out of benefits and much-needed medical care.

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Monthly topic:
Post-Truth Politics Revisited

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"The NATO charter clearly says that any attack on a NATO member shall be treated, by all members, as an attack against all. So that means that, if we attack Greenland, we'll be obligated to go to war against ... ourselves! Gee, that's scary. You really don't want to go to war with the United States. They're insane!"

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