[identity profile] malasadas.livejournal.com posting in [community profile] talkpolitics
This weekend will mark the celebration of Memorial Day in the United States. Here in NYC, the annual Fleet Week began with a "parade" of nine warships steaming up the Hudson River. Despite our oddly American habit of honoring our military by setting fire to chunks of raw cow and drinking a lot, the holiday is an interesting moment of reflection. In my experience, we are normally called upon to thank our veterans and honor the sacrifice that a few make for the rest of the nation, and I agree that is both proper and important -- especially given how our nation has spent the past decade calling upon a comparatively small slice of our population to bear the brunt of global conflicts while the rest of the population has been urged to shop.



Namely, just how big of a military does the United States need and are we letting ourselves become a martial culture?

For a good portion of the past century, it has made a certain brutal logic for America's military to be enormous. My father was born in 1939 just as World War II was officially beginning with the invasion of Poland -- America's military industry busily supplied allied forces and soon was supplying America's efforts to bring down the Axis. Even though victory brought most of the troops home, we were soon in the Cold War, and the Baby Boom generation was born into a world with two Superpowers threatening war against each other and fighting it in proxies battles across the world. I was born in 1969 into a sort of sick stalemate where we expected global annihilation via nuclear weapons.

None of this came cheap in the size and cost of the American military. In 1991, with the collapse of the Soviet Union, we talked about a "peace dividend" and saw some downscaling in personnel and presence, but very little in budget, especially for expensive equipment. Today's "global war on terorrism" may be a military conflict, but as the operation that took out Osama bin Laden demonstrated, quite a lot of that is fought most effectively with intelligence and small forces, not entire Army brigades.

Today, the American military budget is over 660 billion dollars. While this is not huge based on GDP, it is a tremendous expenditure compared to any other country. The United States armed forces maintain thousands of tanks designed to fight sweeping maneuvers across central Europe. We currently have 11 supercarriers with 3 more in production or planned. Our Air Force has over 5500 aircraft and 450 ICBMs. We have over 5100 nuclear warheads deployed, in reserve or in storage. By any stretch of the imagination, our current military power is outsized compared to the threats that we face or could face within the next decade or longer.

But it is not just the size of the U.S. armed forces that can be questioned; it is the mindset of our population towards those forces, especially when it comes to our political class and media.

While I agree that the nation should be respectful of the military and grateful for the service of its membership, our politics practically fetishizes it. The Ryan budget, hailed by Republicans as their "serious" effort to cut the deficit, slashes at entitlement spending and takes a chainsaw to much non-military discretionary spending, while taking a much more modest tack on military spending despite it being the largest discretionary portion of the budget. Politicians are required to bend over backwards to praise the military, and few dare to suggest that we can do without weapons systems. Presidential candidates who lack military service are routinely raked over coals about whether or not they are "qualified" to be Commander in Chief even though the position is explicitly a civilian one. Public celebrations of all kind focus on honoring military service.

This isn't easy -- a proper balance between rightfully honoring and creepily fetishizing is probably impossible to define, but the longer I watch our political and media personae, the more it is obvious that our tremendous military exists not merely because of political calculations but also because of a culture we all help create.

What would be the RIGHT size for the U.S. military in 2011? And would our culture ever actually allow it?

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Date: 25/5/11 22:27 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com
US culture has always been warlike, it's just never been military. A more modern military would emphasize mobility and firepower, and not be geared for massive set-piece nuclear wars as we've nobody who could fight that kind of thing with us in the first place. The fighters would actually work even if you cough near them, the tanks and infantry fighting vehicles would be green, and the US Army's firepower as far as I know is still well ahead of everybody.

As far as accepting it.....I think that it would require the entire Republican Congressional delegation to undergo a complete personality transplant first.

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Date: 25/5/11 22:29 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com
In particular the USA should scrap the F-22 and F-35, overpriced parade-ground bullshit that would fail on the battlefield. The more we spend on it, the more we throw good money after bad. The US government should also focus greater effort on the kind of military needed to fight urban counterinsurgency campaigns, which is what war's going to look more like these days. The massive bomber fleets of WWII weren't able to do much against guys like Tito in WWII, and there's no USSR that justifies them.

The USA could also prune back its nuclear arsenal and anachronistic military bases while increasing its soldiers in bases where they really might be needed (see: South Korea). The USA currently could stagnate for 30 years and it'd still be where it is now compared to the rest of the world for the entirety of that 30 years. There's no reason we can't work smarter, not harder.

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Date: 25/5/11 22:32 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pluckedflowers.livejournal.com
"I think that it would require the entire Republican Congressional delegation to undergo a complete personality transplant first."

Surely you don't mean to suggest the Democrats are any less committed to US militancy than their Republican counterparts. At this historical juncture I can't see any reason to make such a claim.

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Date: 25/5/11 22:34 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] hikarugenji.livejournal.com
I think that it would require the entire Republican Congressional delegation to undergo a complete personality transplant first.

I hate many things about Republican ideology, but one of the most annoying to me is how they've successfully managed to create this idea that it's unpatriotic or insulting to individual soldiers to talk about reducing the size of the military or scaling back military operations.

I still remember someone telling me, apparently seriously, that being against the war in Iraq (this was mid-2000's) was equivalent to spitting in the face of every combat veteran.

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Date: 25/5/11 23:19 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] meus-ovatio.livejournal.com
This isn't easy -- a proper balance between rightfully honoring and creepily fetishizing is probably impossible to define, but the longer I watch our political and media personae, the more it is obvious that our tremendous military exists not merely because of political calculations but also because of a culture we all help create.
See: Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2

I played this game and was filled with depression. COD:MW 3 makes me even more depressed. We're not even trying to acknowledge the horrible consequences of war anymore.

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Date: 26/5/11 00:03 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] a-new-machine.livejournal.com
"Nuke DC!" [nobody dies of radiation poisoning]

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Date: 25/5/11 23:28 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] meus-ovatio.livejournal.com
What would be the RIGHT size for the U.S. military in 2011?
The right-sized military will be a military tailored to our current requirements in Korea, keeping up with the Chans, and greatly reducing any strategic nuclear assets.

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Date: 25/5/11 23:28 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] the-rukh.livejournal.com
Diverting money to military spending keeps those tasty campaign contributions rolling in. What are you going to do, get elected without it? Psh, no.

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Date: 25/5/11 23:30 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] blue-mangos.livejournal.com
The Global Peace Index for 2011 was released today and one of the measures was a country's military spending as a percentage of GDP. America is #82 on the list. I think a few people here might be very interested in who is #1 (http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2011/may/25/global-peace-index-2011)

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Date: 25/5/11 23:32 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] the-rukh.livejournal.com
Well hey, we beat South Africa, kind of surprising. I wonder if I can get a foam "we're number 82" hand made.

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Date: 26/5/11 04:07 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] mrsilence.livejournal.com
Well that's what happens when your GDP is a negative number.

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Date: 26/5/11 13:01 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] airiefairie.livejournal.com
We win! No surprise there...
And the US base is gone now, but still we win.

Of course we have volcanoes, so......

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In honor of the American military

Date: 26/5/11 00:36 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sophia-sadek.livejournal.com
Chris Hedges has some interesting observation on martial culture in his book on War (http://www.amazon.com/Force-That-Gives-Meaning-ebook/dp/B001FOPWIA/). He contends that it destroys authentic culture. We saw some of that up close during the McCarthy Era. The Christian tradition of proscribing literature is an example of martial culture attacking that which is authentic in favor of that which is artificial.

I have tremendous respect for the military. After all, they put their lives on the line to ensure that America remains an enslaved nation.

Re: In honor of the American military

Date: 26/5/11 15:47 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] raichu100.livejournal.com
"I have tremendous respect for the military. After all, they put their lives on the line to ensure that America remains an enslaved nation."

wut

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Date: 26/5/11 00:46 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] rasilio.livejournal.com
To answer your question one must answer what you think America's geopolitical role should be. You also need to define how you will measure "size"

My personal opinion is that our peacetime military expenditures should be limited to no greater than 2% of GDP (40% of what they are today) and in general should stay below 1.5% (about a third of todays).

In terms of active duty troops, Our reserves and guard should be about half the size it is today and our standing troops should be about a third the size of today.

Our focus in expenditure should be to build small quantities of the most advanced weapons possible each year to keep the production lines for them open so that if we do end up in an actual shooting war we can quickly ramp up production.

Things like, yes we should keep building F-22's at the rate of 2 per year, just to keep the assembly lines open rather than buying several hundred F-35's per year we should buy something like 10.

Then after that we need to focus our efforts on developing high tech force multipliers and the best special forces in the world in the active military.

The goal is to have the ability to deal with the occasional asymetric threat on their own terms and if a real shooting war ever crops up to have just enough of a military in place to keep the enemy off balance until our Industrial capacity and reserves can be effectively called up.

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Date: 26/5/11 01:08 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] anfalicious.livejournal.com
Do you think the fact that the US military structure was set up to fight a superpower has led to inefficiencies in the GWT?

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Date: 26/5/11 00:46 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] anfalicious.livejournal.com
I think the US should put all of its resources into creating the anti-matter ray defense systems that will be necessary when the aliens attack.

And I mean ALL resources. No more roads, hospitals, schools or any of that claptrap.

I agree...

Date: 26/5/11 00:59 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sophia-sadek.livejournal.com
Those are luxuries compared to the necessity of the anti-matter machine. Freedom first, health and education later.

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Date: 26/5/11 04:36 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] a-new-machine.livejournal.com
That'd take some sort of direct attack on, say, New York by the tentacled psychic aliens, though. And THAT will never happen, of course.

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Date: 26/5/11 04:03 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] rasilio.livejournal.com
Yes and if you're the sort to actually believe the fairy tales it is pretty clear the answer is Wall Street.

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Date: 26/5/11 02:24 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] badlydrawnjeff.livejournal.com
What would be the RIGHT size for the U.S. military in 2011?

I think the right size is probably a little smaller than where we're at right now. The reality is that we're still the world's police when it matters, and too many nations rely on our muscle to protect them when the chips are down, which they know we will. Let's face it - Canada doesn't have to invest heavily in a military when we're more than ready and willing to cover them if need be.

I don't think there's anyone, conservative or liberal, who wouldn't like to see it smaller and more tactical. But until international circumstances change, I don't see how that's possible.

And would our culture ever actually allow it?

I'm not sure if polling has ever been done, but I suspect people already believe the military is larger than it actually is. Thus, I think that we could gradually draw down the military and most people wouldn't even notice.

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Date: 27/5/11 23:33 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] http://users.livejournal.com/-wanderer-/
and too many nations rely on our muscle to protect them when the chips are down, which they know we will.

To me, this is just another reason to scale back (some) commitments. For example, Japan saves tons of money on defense and doesn't worry too much about pissing off its neighbors because it knows the US has its back. There are no consequences for poor decisions.

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Date: 26/5/11 05:09 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] policraticus.livejournal.com
I think that we are significantly less martial of a culture than we have been in the not too distant past and that the military is becoming increasingly marginalized and segregated from the mainstream culture.

The size of our military budget in raw numbers is a consequence of our overweaning GDP and the uses we have put it to in the last generation. Since we are the defacto arbiter of trade and security on the globe and since our economy is so closely tied to international trade and stability, I think it is sized fairly modestly. Could we do it cheaper or more efficiently? Sure, but what can't we say that about?

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Date: 26/5/11 15:50 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] raichu100.livejournal.com
"Could we do it cheaper or more efficiently? Sure, but what can't we say that about?"

Very good point...

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Date: 26/5/11 13:07 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] htpcl.livejournal.com
And Tuesday was the Day of the Cyrillic Alphabet and the Slavonic culture here. St. Cyril & Methodius and all that, the day of school festivals and proms, and all in all a day dedicated to knowledge and education.

I much prefer those sorts of holidays but yeah.
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Credits & Style Info

Monthly topic:
Post-Truth Politics Revisited

Dailyquote:
"The NATO charter clearly says that any attack on a NATO member shall be treated, by all members, as an attack against all. So that means that, if we attack Greenland, we'll be obligated to go to war against ... ourselves! Gee, that's scary. You really don't want to go to war with the United States. They're insane!"

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