Cops and Firefighters turning against the GOP?

[kinvore.livejournal.com]

The liberal media isn't doing their job and talking much about this story yet, but it's making its rounds in places like HuffPo and the like. I won't bother to link until I find more objective sources (aside from this), but let me share what I've heard thus far and hope I haven't been punked by an elaborate April Fool's joke.

Firefighters and police have long been two unions with strong conservative leanings, regularly endorsing GOP candidates more often than Democrats. Therefore it was notable when they stood in support of unions during the Wisconsin "budget" proposals even though their unions were exempt from losing their right to bargain collectively.

In Ohio they are doing the same thing, but this time police or firefighters aren't exempt. One could argue that they done goofed when doing this, and that consequences will never be the same.

Chuck Canterbury, National President of the Fraternal Order of Police has apparently warned the GOP that they are taking things too far. According to HuffPo he told them that “There is a distinct possibility that the pro-labor candidate in the next election will be looked at much more favorably than their overall record". And while I know HuffPo isn't the best source for information out there, so far Mr. Canterbury hasn't disputed these remarks. He was also on Rachel Maddow and his rhetoric should worry Republicans.

This could result in a huge paradigm shift if even police and firefighters turn on the GOP, both politically and financially. What kind of impact do you see in all this, assuming Republicans stay the course? Since they've embraced the Tea Party I don't see how they back off without suffering an outright implosion.

Their biggest mistake was assuming their gains were because mainstream America had suddenly embraced the Tea Party as well. The last election was a mandate on the economy and the lack of jobs, and Republicans are ignoring this at their peril.

Comments

[box-in-the-box.livejournal.com]

Personally, I think a lot of the current pendulum swing away from the Republicans is for the exact same reasons as the pendulum swing away from the Democrats that led to the GOP's midterm gains in the first place; namely, the voters expected the people they elected to do everything they wanted right away, and when they didn't, it inspired a temper-tantrum in the electorate.

Granted, I have plenty of other objections to the current crop of Republicans, but before Scott Walker decided to stick his dick in a hornet's nest, it struck me that what we were seeing was basically this ...

2009:
"We voted for you, so fix everything now!"
"Actually, it's going to take some time -"
"Fuck you, then! I'm voting for the other guys next time!"

2011:
"We voted for you, so fix everything now!"
"Actually, it's going to take some time -"
"Fuck you, then! I'm voting for the other guys next time!"

[blue-mangos.livejournal.com]

Can you explain why it is not? Because it very much looks the case to those of us outside America.

[badlydrawnjeff.livejournal.com]

I disagree with the entire thing. The issue is a fickle, unreliable center trapped between two choices that aren't wonderful for them, and their reactions. It's not that the people they elected in 2008 were going to take time to do what they need to, but what the elected officials of 2008 decided to do were ridiculously offensive to the majority, and wasn't what they bargained for.

We may see that same swing next year, but I don't think it will be as extreme.

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

On the contrary, having seen the abysmal failures of the Palin-Angle crowd the GOP appears to be repeating that kind of politics on a much larger scale. The Democrats aren't any better at learning not to do that, but it takes decades with them. And now the GOP is having to lie in the bed it made when the Tea Party elected so many Republicans into the Congress.

[badlydrawnjeff.livejournal.com]

On the contrary, having seen the abysmal failures of the Palin-Angle crowd the GOP appears to be repeating that kind of politics on a much larger scale.

What failures are you speaking of?

And now the GOP is having to lie in the bed it made when the Tea Party elected so many Republicans into the Congress.

It seems to be working (http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/general_politics/march_2011/57_okay_with_government_shutdown_if_it_leads_to_deeper_budget_cuts).

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

Reid was supposed to be a loser by a 30 point margin. He won by a 5% margin. Not because people liked him, but because Angle was *that* batshit crazy. Where now the GOP is undoing child labor laws, voting against puppies, calling the army a bunch of feminized sissies, ignoring blatantly that the Supreme Court has struck down sodomy laws, trying to legalize murder of abortion doctors......

[badlydrawnjeff.livejournal.com]

Reid was supposed to be a loser by a 30 point margin. He won by a 5% margin. Not because people liked him, but because Angle was *that* batshit crazy

Credit the GOTV from the Democrats on that one. The RNC's bumbling probably cost the Republicans five winnable seats federally last election.

Where now the GOP is undoing child labor laws, voting against puppies, calling the army a bunch of feminized sissies, ignoring blatantly that the Supreme Court has struck down sodomy laws, trying to legalize murder of abortion doctors......

None of which are true, of course, but thanks for proving my point.

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

All of them are. Including that the GOP hates puppies.

[blue-mangos.livejournal.com]

hmmmm, maybe the US needs a viable third party system like Canada ;)

[il-mio-gufo.livejournal.com]

are you talking about the party Paul and his boy influenced?

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

A problem with this is that same electorate gave the Democrats a virtual decades-long monopoly on the House of Representatives and that at no point during the Bush Administration's three consecutive victories in the Congressional elections did their largest majorities approach what the Dems squandered in '06. Too, in 2010 the Democrats ran a lousy campaign with little or no turnout on their part but a great deal of it on the part of the Republicans. If you're lackadasical about it, you will pay the price, the Dems were, and so they are.

[telemann.livejournal.com]

The National Fraternal Order of Police (300,000 members) supported McCain in 2008. And for a candidate to receive the endorsement of the Fraternal Order of Police, he must receive a two-third majority of the National Board, which is made up of one Trustee from each of the organization' s State Lodges.

[telemann.livejournal.com]

I know that, so I gave you more information about "the rest of the country." And for what it's worth: police unions tend to support gun control laws that affect them direct: such as bullets that pierce bullet proof vests, and semi automatic guns that fire multiple rounds per second, not the blanket statement you made "to take guns away from everyone but them."

[mrbogey.livejournal.com]

'...such as bullets that pierce bullet proof vests...'

So police hate hunting rounds but have no problem with handguns. Because handguns are less likely to penetrate ballistic vests.

'...and semi automatic guns that fire multiple rounds per second...'

Well if you can pull the trigger that fast...

Ok, so now they hate all handguns including revolvers.

Sounds like they hate every gun that they don't own.

[sandwichwarrior.livejournal.com]

Sounds like they hate every gun that they don't own.

Ding!

I think you've got a winner there.

[telemann.livejournal.com]

I've meant to post about this, but the four key states (Wisconsin, Ohio, Florida, and Michigan): all the Republican governors won by pretty small voter margins. Currently, public opinion polls show that if the election were held today, some would lose as much by 20 points; and this is going to have a major impact on elections as soon as this November* (e.g. where the anti union law passed could be held for a referendum if enough signatures are gathered within the next 90 days, there by nullifying the bill just signed, pending the vote in November). Those are key states that any presidential candidate needs to win, all states that Obama won in 2008, interestingly enough.

--------------
* and that's not including recall efforts in several of those states for either state house officials or the governor.

[kinvore.livejournal.com]

Yeah this whole thing has been a boom for the Democrats so far, they finally found an issue that resonates with mainstream America and for once they aren't being timid in capitalizing on it.

Frankly I was hoping the Dems were on the way out, we need to break the duopoly they hold on our government with the Repubs.

[badlydrawnjeff.livejournal.com]

Yeah this whole thing has been a boom for the Democrats so far, they finally found an issue that resonates with mainstream America and for once they aren't being timid in capitalizing on it.

Of course, they've had to be dishonest about it from day one to get there, but hey, whatever it takes, right?

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

As opposed to the GOP with its philandering diaper-wearing boy-diddling "Ban Gay marriage and keep queers out of the army because Jesus sez so" paragons of morality and honesty? Bringing up dishonesty in politics is like noticing there's blood in a slaughterhouse or skunks smell bad. The answer is "yes, and so?".

[kinvore.livejournal.com]

Dishonest about what exactly?

[badlydrawnjeff.livejournal.com]

Dishonest about everything from the budget (http://politifact.com/wisconsin/statements/2011/feb/18/rachel-maddow/rachel-maddow-says-wisconsin-track-have-budget-sur/) to how Wisconsin is responding (http://politifact.com/wisconsin/statements/2011/feb/16/progressive-change-campaign-committee/group-says-gov-scott-walker-threatened-send-out-na/).

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

Nope, they just needed to tell folks that Scott Walker was trying to take away collective bargaining.

Or do you somehow think telling people that is dishonest?

[badlydrawnjeff.livejournal.com]

Well, some bargaining, not all. So somewhat dishonest.

[mybodymycoffin.livejournal.com]

It's very simple: Rachel Maddow was wrong about a Wisconsin budget surplus. Ergo, the Democrats are dishonest and pleasepaynoattentiontotheclasswarfarebehindthecurtain.

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

Anyone involved in class warfare is a communist and must be kicked out of America ASAP

(unless it's warfare that favors the rich)

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

Well, when you consider the Wall Street Journal condemned everybody in the public sector as a bunch of parasites (presumably including the 3 million active-duty military personnel), it's no surprise. Most people in the USA back the Unions, not the governors, and most people want higher taxes on the richest sections of the population. If only the Democrats were the kind of organized party that could actually *use* that reservoir of popular support.

[farchivist.livejournal.com]

If only the Democrats were the kind of organized party that could actually *use* that reservoir of popular support.

I don't think it would be hard to get that organization.
Or to win some Repubs who are tired of the vicious economic conservative/social conservative bitchfight.

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

I would have thought it entirely impossible to screw up control of both houses of Congress and the Executive with sufficient degrees to render working with the other party at all, but the Obama Administration showed how you do that......

[frodomyhero.livejournal.com]

Bring on Bernie Sanders and the independents. We need new blood. Not the same old song from the Dems or the Tea Party or the Republicans.

[jerseycajun.livejournal.com]

And when they're elected, they become the new version of the old. Names change, but the culture has become intractable, irrespective of party, or 'independent' status.

[harry-beast.livejournal.com]

Unionized public workers will tend to oppose governments that try to rein in their privileges and rewards. It seems more like self-interest than any ideological shift. The impact? If this issue resonates with a lot of people, it could become a new fault line in politics in the United States, pitting bourgeois public workers against the long suffering private sector proletariat forced to shoulder the ever increasing burden of supporting public sector pay, benefits and pensions.

[kinvore.livejournal.com]

I think this is what the GOP was trying to do, pit public workers vs. private workers, but so far this has backfired on them (and I think a large part of why this tactic has failed has been because of the unexpected support that police and firefighters have given the other public unions). I think the middle class is tired of being forced to make sacrifices while business and some of the wealthy are getting tax breaks.

[harry-beast.livejournal.com]

With no easy solutions to the serious economic problems confronting the United States and other countries, there will be a whole lot of pain and sacrifice. It is inevitable that politicians will try to exploit the social divisions that this will cause.

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

Namely by appealing to fear of Shariah law and imposing bans on gays and abortions to give the masses their bread and circuses.

[sandwichwarrior.livejournal.com]

Bread and Circuses!

Look at the Monkey!

[meus-ovatio.livejournal.com]

You mean like how public sector workers pay taxes too? Or does that neat little fact shoot a hole in your ridiculous theory?

[harry-beast.livejournal.com]

If you think that public sector workers shouldn't pay taxes, we will have to disagree.

[meus-ovatio.livejournal.com]

What?

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

I cannot help but assume that your comment is that of a troll.

"bourgeois public workers" LOL!

[mybodymycoffin.livejournal.com]

bourgeois public workers (http://i999.photobucket.com/albums/af118/harharorly/Reactions/chris-christie-2009-11-4-3-10-33.jpg)

Nope.