Cops and Teachers? THEY Don't Pay Taxes!

[paft.livejournal.com]

Wisconsin State Assemblyman Robin Vos lets us all know what he thinks of those taxpaying Wisconsin citizens who work in the public sector:

The reality is they haven’t had to pay for these things, they’re upset about doing it now, and the taxpayers are the ones who definitely understand this because they get it, they’ve been doing this in the private sector for years, it’s time we had the same thing happen in the public sector…The fact that my Democratic colleagues want to go back to the taxpayer and have them pay higher taxes because someone shouldn’t pay 12% towards their healthcare….We are standing with the taxpayers all across Wisconsin. It’s amazing the outpouring of support that we’ve been getting from the people outside the Capitol Square, the people who are in the reality of the world, not the place that we’re sitting.

Howard Dean does a very good job of refuting Kudlow and Vos’ fiction that the demonstrations are all about the cuts in benefits and not about the elimination of collective bargaining. The capper to this exchange, however, comes near the end of the segment, when a sign appears just over Vos’ shoulder on the right. Not the kind of thing Kudlow could choreograph.

It beautifully highlights the idiocy of Vos' fiction that the demonstrators are, in some fundamental way, less American than other Americans. Does he really think cops and teachers don't pay taxes, or “live in the reality of the world?”

Crossposted from Thoughtcrimes
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Comments

[debergerac.livejournal.com]

it's the group that always brings up roads, schools, social security and healthcare whenever someone from the group that advocates smaller government dares to reply.

[mrsilence.livejournal.com]

Right...and how is this group described accurately as the "Government is good" group?

Have you EVER heard anyone ever say that government never does anything wrong. Categorically speaking, this would be a necessary assertion to believe that someone thinks "Government IS (always) good".

Or if you have a less stringent requirement that they merely advocate government intervention in issues, then you sometimes suggest that government should do X or should do Y in response to a particular issue too, no doubt. OMG sometimes the government may be useful in achieving some desirable end where the government is an appropriate tool to achieve that end.

So I guess that makes you a "government is good"-er too!

Or, perhaps, is this label a mere parody of their position, because you don't agree with the suggestions made. Or think the suggestions are too frequent.

Either way labelling that is neither accurate, nor helpful to the conversation. Try debating issues, not strawmen.

mr silence is in the "i touched a nerve" group

[debergerac.livejournal.com]

to what group do these strawmen that you referred to belong?

i belong to the "smaller government is better" group, and have absolutely no shame in admitting that. how bout you?

Re: debergerac is in the "it was my nerve that was touched" group

[mrsilence.livejournal.com]

Interestingly, you'll note that I'm also in the "smaller government is better" group. In fact, most people I know are.

Literally no-one I have ever met thinks government is an unalloyed good. That you think, or at least label, some people that way is the strawmen I referred to.

The only real bone of contention is what the appropriate functions of government are and how small is the minimum size necessary to achieve those functions.

Re: debergerac is in the "it was my nerve that was touched" group

[debergerac.livejournal.com]

if you are in the smaller government is good camp, why are you pretending the bigger government is good camp doesn't exist? public sector vs private sector battles are waged in dozens of political communities every day. somebody certainly believes in bigger government.

Re: debergerac is in the "it was my nerve that was touched" group

[mrsilence.livejournal.com]

I'm not pretending it doesn't exist.

Just that 99% of the people you accuse of being in that camp are not. By attacking them as being people who think "government is good", you are attacking a strawman, the same way as accusing someone who believe in social justice is a communist, or anyone who believes in border control is a racist and so on.

Re: debergerac is in the "it was my nerve that was touched" group

[debergerac.livejournal.com]

i don't recall accusing you of being in any camp. who are these 99 percent you think i'm referring to?