(no subject)

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

http://beta.news.yahoo.com/mccain-rips-republican-candidates-isolationism-165050541.html


John McCain and even Lindsey Graham have accussed the modern GOP and the currect presidential frontrunners of having an "isolationist" streak. That's an old song on the left but it's a bit of a surprise to hear it from old Republican hands like McCain and Graham.

One, I think this somewhat highlights the ever more noticable divide in ideology in the current GOP. Second, it's actually nice to see a bit of the old McCain rather than the shameless whore who traded most of his dignity for two failed runs at the White House and who brought the blight that is Sarah Palin to the national stage.

In any case, the Republican jockying for the candidate position might actually prove to be interesting. I think the GOP actually gets that dragged up some dusty old man to run against a younger, more dynamic candiate would just lead to a repeat of the Bob Dole fiasco. That would please no one but whoever writes jokes for Jay Leno and, of course, the Obama camp.

Comments

[dwer.livejournal.com]

It interesting, considering McCain is also accusing illegal immigrants of causing the Arizona wildfires. There's absolutely NO evidence of this happening, but it'll increase his vote in the primary...

[kylinrouge.livejournal.com]

it's actually nice to see a bit of the old McCain

What other McCain is there?

I can't take any criticism seriously from a dude who doesn't know how to use a computer.

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

There was the one who was serious about campainge finance reform. Haven't seen that one in a while.

[jerseycajun.livejournal.com]

I can't remember a time when McCain wasn't all for an interventionist foreign policy strategy. How is this different for him?

Needless to say, I like the words the Republican candidates are saying regarding interventionism, but I don't vote for words. And I don't buy the sincerity with which most of them are speaking about ending it either. I remember a certain candidate running a few years back on pulling out of our wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. He's in now, and we're still over there (and a few more places for good measure).

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

Why does everyone talk about isolationism like it's a bad thing?

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

The last time we were big on that some cranky Germans and their buddies wrecked a bunch of stuff and beat up our friends.

"Our" friends?

[montecristo.livejournal.com]

The "WE" you are invoking is nothing more than a religious mysticism. It doesn't exist. You are merely imposing a false facade of dubious interpretations on the random, or not so random, workings out of the whims held by various members of various politically influencial factions. It is mythology, much like the story of Thor or Zeus to explain the thunder. The last time "we" were "big on that" (and "we" weren't, not really) U.S. government sent a shipload of Jewish refugees, supposedly "Our friends," back to Nazi Europe rather than let them into the poor, overcrowded U.S. Some friendship, eh? How about those "cranky Germans" too? What, they were mutants? Did some virus get in the water to make them so cranky? No. They fell prey to the same kind of fantastic collectivist narrative spinning that you are making in this very comment. There is no "we," which is why "isolationism" is nothing more than a cheap smear used by one political faction to demonize other people and factions that do not share their own particular fantasies about foreign peoples and organizations.

Re: "Our" friends?

[http://users.livejournal.com/-wanderer-/]

You're making this much more abstract that it was intended. Is the UK not "our" friend?

Re: "Our" friends?

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

Cut back on the coffee, FFS. I meant France, the UK, Finland and such. All of whom were friends of the US.

[root-fu.livejournal.com]

Foreigners demolished their economices and infrastructure in the process leaving the United States intact. It gave America and Russia the edge we needed to become superpowers.

Maybe, we should let them do it again.

[a-new-machine.livejournal.com]

It depends on which isolationism you mean. If you mean protectionism, detachment, and dis-engaging from the outside world, then it's a death knell for the economy, our political influence, and all the benefits those bring. If you mean an end to foreign adventurism, coupled with aggressive diplomatic engagement and free trade, then we'd probably be OK. The problem is that the word can mean both, and few people are clear as to which, or it's situational. Most Republicans wouldn't drop our diplomatic relationship with Israel, but quite a few would like to see us defund the UN. Most would keep forces in Afghanistan and Iraq, but would pull troops out of European and Asian nations.

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

Well it kind of depends on whether I'm feeling pragmatic or idealistic.

(altho I AM for defunding the UN, the rest of it, is almost "whatever"

[deborahkla.livejournal.com]

We live in a global economy. If we cut ourselves off from the rest of the world, we might as well dig our own graves.

TBH, that anyone should ask such a question in this day and age is more than a little frightening. Does the right wing not have any concept whatsoever of the fact that the world is changing, and we need to keep up with it just to survive? Or are they still living in this happy-go-lucky, Leave-it-to-Beaver vision of 1950s America? It's interesting that they point to the fifties as a great example of a booming American economy, while conveniently overlooking the fact that the tax rate on incomes of $300K+ was at one point as high as 91%. Gee, think that might have had something to do with it?

Of course not, according to the right wing. Just like the fact that the revenue lost through the Bush tax cuts nearly equaled the current social security shortfall.

Cutting taxes is the GOP's religion--it hasn't worked for years, but they still believe in it.

[root-fu.livejournal.com]

They read the 'no man is an island' poem in school and had their youth corrupted.

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

While not being an exact causation, it works as well as anything else!

[malakh-abaddon.livejournal.com]

Honestly a little isolationism is not a bad thing. While history has shown it is not a good thing, right now we need to focus on ourselves, not policing and saving the world.

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

I think this is where I come down on the topic, since I tend towards being a pragmatic :D

Idealistically, given my own personal inclinations, I'd tell every else in the world to "go pound sand"

[surferelf.livejournal.com]

McCain and Graham are from another era. They could not be elected in today's Republican Party if they weren't already incumbents.

The policy position that any Republican presidential candidate takes is totally irrelevant as it is required to be absurd to the point of insanity (http://www.fareedzakaria.com/home/Articles/Entries/2011/616_How_Todays_Conservatism_Lost_Touch_with_Reality.html) in order to win the primaries. What they need is someone who is sufficiently charismatic that the swing voters will not care that s/he is spouting nonsense. I don't see that right now, but it's still early days.

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

Can I introduce you to Mitt Romney and Sarah Palin?

[surferelf.livejournal.com]

Last time I checked--admittedly several weeks ago--swing voters loathe Sarah and Mitt. Their charisma doesn't extend beyond the conservative cultural identity.

[root-fu.livejournal.com]

I ceased taking McCain seriously when he ceased allowing his computer illiteracy to prevent him from passing internet regulatory acts.

Not a strong believer in allowing the blind to color match ones clothing?