Cops and Teachers? THEY Don't Pay Taxes!

[paft.livejournal.com]

Wisconsin State Assemblyman Robin Vos lets us all know what he thinks of those taxpaying Wisconsin citizens who work in the public sector:

The reality is they haven’t had to pay for these things, they’re upset about doing it now, and the taxpayers are the ones who definitely understand this because they get it, they’ve been doing this in the private sector for years, it’s time we had the same thing happen in the public sector…The fact that my Democratic colleagues want to go back to the taxpayer and have them pay higher taxes because someone shouldn’t pay 12% towards their healthcare….We are standing with the taxpayers all across Wisconsin. It’s amazing the outpouring of support that we’ve been getting from the people outside the Capitol Square, the people who are in the reality of the world, not the place that we’re sitting.

Howard Dean does a very good job of refuting Kudlow and Vos’ fiction that the demonstrations are all about the cuts in benefits and not about the elimination of collective bargaining. The capper to this exchange, however, comes near the end of the segment, when a sign appears just over Vos’ shoulder on the right. Not the kind of thing Kudlow could choreograph.

It beautifully highlights the idiocy of Vos' fiction that the demonstrators are, in some fundamental way, less American than other Americans. Does he really think cops and teachers don't pay taxes, or “live in the reality of the world?”

Crossposted from Thoughtcrimes
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Comments

[whoasksfinds.livejournal.com]

because limiting collective bargaining for public sector unions to salary negotiations is definitely going to make unions irrelevant, and its definitely going to bring back child labor, 10 hour work days, and sweat shops too! OMG scott walker is hitler!

[paft.livejournal.com]

Yes, limiting collective bargaining in that manner does make unions irrelevant. And yes, without the stick of unions over their heads employers HAVE been known do demand 10 hour workdays from their employees.

[whoasksfinds.livejournal.com]

limiting collective bargaining in that manner does make unions irrelevant

because public sector unions negotiating for salaries is irrelevant. and private sector unions are irrelevant. nice logic paft.

without the stick of unions over their heads employers HAVE been known do demand 10 hour workdays from their employees.

thats funny, because ive never worked a union job, and ive never had to work a 10 hour day in the private sector. and those evil governments, always demanding their employees work overtime without pay!

[paft.livejournal.com]

WAF: because public sector unions negotiating for salaries is irrelevant. and private sector unions are irrelevant. nice logic paft.

Limit unions in that manner and yes, they are irrelevant.

paft without the stick of unions over their heads employers HAVE been known do demand 10 hour workdays from their employees.
waf: thats funny, because ive never worked a union job, and ive never had to work a 10 hour day in the private sector.

You're lucky. As someone who's been in the workforce since 1986, I have. More than once. And so have many other Americans, especially those who work in the service industry.

[whoasksfinds.livejournal.com]

Limit unions in that manner and yes, they are irrelevant.

this is just illogical. wages are relevant, as are private sector unions.

And so have many other Americans, especially those who work in the service industry.

good thing this has nothing to do with private sector unions. are you really this concerned about the working conditions for public school teachers when this bill passes?

[paft.livejournal.com]

Yes. This is a test case. If Wisconsin succeeds in eliminating collective bargaining, other states will follow suit, and as someone who includes public school teachers among my family and friends, I am concerned about their working conditions.

[whoasksfinds.livejournal.com]

as if the teachers union rights to negotiate pension and health care benefits is the only thing between teachers and the sweatshop.

[paft.livejournal.com]

Unions are a significant shield between ALL workers and the sweatshop.

[farchivist.livejournal.com]

because ive never worked a union job, and ive never had to work a 10 hour day in the private sector

Now I know you're lying.
- You're a Marine, even if you are currently a reservist. You have worked overtime without pay. Especially if you've been deployed. The military is the definition of 24/7/365 on-call.
- You're about to finish an accounting degree and will have full-time employment as an accountant. You KNOW you will be working 12-16 hour days between January and April.

Pro-tip: If you're going to play ignorant, lock your journal.

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

The Marines are not the private sector :D

[paft.livejournal.com]

Is accounting?

Sheesh!

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

Which he hasn't started yet, honestly! don't you people read.

Re: Sheesh!

[farchivist.livejournal.com]

He's got an internship. He knows better.

[farchivist.livejournal.com]

No, it isn't. But I sure would consider it a 'union job' and I'm irritated by his "never had to work a 10 hour day" spiel.

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

I don't know how it is now, but it certainly didn't FEEL like a union job when I was in the military :D

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

ive never had to work a 10 hour day in the private sector.

Lucky you. It happens, I can personally attest.

[whoasksfinds.livejournal.com]

life is so hard

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

Also, when you consider outsourcing labor to other countries, its the norm.

[whoasksfinds.livejournal.com]

and people who are afraid of the bill in wisconsin leading to the return of a 10 hour work day are just being paranoid.

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

At least they get paid for it, lower management and salaried employees don't as a rule. It happens to be state law (not union) that most employers cannot work their employees more than 8 hours in a day without payiung them over time.

[farchivist.livejournal.com]

If hourly. In GA, all salaried personnel are exempt from that restriction. Thus, my Big Bosses all work 60-80 hour weeks.

[paft.livejournal.com]

And of course, no wealthy and influential employer and political contributor would ever DREAM of breaking state law, because non-union employees would tell them, "You can't do that, bossman! it's against the law!"

And the employer would knuckle down and pay them the overtime chop chop instead of firing them on some pretext!

Right?

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

I confess I have no idea about "wealthy and influential employer and political contributor" and what they would do. But it doesn't happen as often as you want to imply I also know that construction work is different than working in a machine shop. I mean I generally pay my employees 8 hours for 6 and half hours work, not because I'm a great guy, but becasue I can't firgure jobs at what should be the going rate and get them.
While we are on this sligh diversion, you know as well as I do, one of the reasons emplyers can get away with a lot of that crap is because of our illegal alien work force, and I would be all for enforcing the laws already on the books against employers.

[paft.livejournal.com]

What makes you think it "doesn't happen as often" as I've implied?

Some of the worst employer abuses I've seen and heard about have happened in areas largely unaffected by an influx of illegal aliens. Blaming it on them is a cop-out.

[yes-justice.livejournal.com]

its definitely going to bring back child labor

Yeah, no one wants that (http://blogs.riverfronttimes.com/dailyrft/2011/02/leno_mocks_missouri_child_labo.php)!