Please, God, don't send the FBI to my house

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

So, I'm relatively certain of what I am about to tell you, but go ahead and disagree with me:

The US govt will, at some level, scan this post and it's contents to see if it's harmless or harmful based upon the fact that I am going to talk about freedom of speech and use a phrase which, I believe, will be picked up on some filter and be observed.

In 1989 the band known as "The Offspring" made a 12 song album, the last song of which was Kill The President
[it was a pretty dark album, overall; other songs include "Beheaded" and "Out on Patrol" and "Tehran" {originally titled "Baghdad" interestingly enough}



In a world without leaders
Who'd start all the wars?
The world that you're saving
Will always be yours

Kill the president
Voice the reason
Unify with that single line
Stop the man with the power
Of the government
A leader's not the center
Of democracy

In a world without leaders
Who'd make people starve?
The world that we're saving
Will always be ours

Everyone says
Well maybe I'll make a difference
Thinking they've got plenty of time
But you're squeezed
A little tighter everyday
Punished before you commit a crime

In a world without leaders
Who'd start all the wars?
The world that you’re saving
Will always be yours

Kill the president
Voice the reason
Unify that single line
Stop the man with the power
Of the government
A leader's not the center
Of democracy

America
All of your enemies
Come from within
But you lash out so
It is seen
Like some frightened child
In an angry world
Or the fall of Rome
Your demise comes
From your own hands

In a world without leaders
Who'd start all the wars?
The world that you’re saving
Will always be yours

In a world without leaders
We might have a chance
But we'll never see it
As long as there's
Kill the president
Kill the president
Kill the president
Kill the president
Kill the president
Kill the president now!

Now, they weren't a big name band when the album/song came out, and didn't hit it big till the 90's. There was, to my knowledge, no hullabaloo about it. And maybe I'm making mountains out of molehills by even talking about it.

But, let's not ignore what is right in front of our noses. A band was able to produce and sell their music, despite it's being...well, anti-establishment [for lack of a better term]

Now, let's be clear: *I am not inciting violence with this and I don't think the band was either. I am against the violent overthrow of our government/violent intimidation of our government officials*

This speech is protected by the first amendment and, I don't think, anybody would suggest such speech should be banned. (any takers?) I mean, if you look at the album, it's clearly social/political criticism [and *NOT* a call to action--although debate that if you wish] and that, to my knowledge, is clearly protected by the 1st amendment.

So, final points:

A) Do you think this post will be watched/screened by the govt?
B) Do you think this post *should be* watched/screened by the govt?
C) What do you think of the statement made in the song: "A leader is not the center of a democracy"
D) What do you think of the statement made in the song that begins at: "America, all your enemies come from within..." and ends with "your demise comes from your own hands"
E) What do you think of the song overall?
F) Should such a song be protected under the first amendment/freedom of speech?

and for my own safety/peace of mind:

G) Let me repeat how clear I wish to be: I want no harm to come to Obama/Bush/Clinton/Bush/Carter [we got any other living presidents?] nor do I want harm to come to any of our elected officials, regardless of how much I may disagree with their politics

edit:

if the first few responses are an indication, most people will tell me I need not be afraid

but C/D/F are just as interesting to me as A/B, which, I'm not that concerned with, but better safe than sorry, ja?

Comments

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

he's not passing any legislation
he's not in congress

The fact is, he has displayed his ability to work w/o a teleprompter.
Not to mention: the last president who *did not* use a teleprompter was....uh...what, Carter? Ford? Nixon? I mean, c'mon.

everyone except for Jimmy Carter would have to learn on the job how to be president (well, of the possible future presidents, that is)

So....can you provide me something other than vagaries like: "he needs a teleprompter" and "he's pushing through partisan legislation"?
And also: for that second point, you do know republicans are *forcing* it to be partisan, right? They vote against whatever the pres does just so that they don't loose street cred with their base.

You realize HCR, as was done, was an idea of Mitt Romney, right? It wasn't the single-payer dream of leftists. Obama compromises which pisses off his liberal base and it doesn't matter what he does, just being there pisses off the conservative base. He's a moderate.

What, specifically, has he done to make you think he is not a leader? [and please remember to differ this from: "what has he done that you do not like?" cause that isn't what I am asking]

[aintshesweet-x.livejournal.com]

I gave you reasons. It may be past 2:30 am where I am, but I know exactly what tricks you're using in a debate to try to corner me; once a Political Science major, always a Political Science major. Don't even try to pull that one on me. I am well versed in the subjects of political debate and trickery.

Leaders do not ignore the opinions of the other side. He is very pompous. He'd call himself King if he could. Leaders must be humble, open minded and remember they work for the people. Our president is very "me me me". You can disagree with the other side, but do it respectfully. Obama says a lot of snarky and uncalled for things to Republican members of Congress.

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

We're both on east coast time.

Awesome, you know how to debate. Please, debate with me. Don't just say "don't even try to pull that on one me"
Cause, ya know, that is vague
Which trick am I trying to pull?

"Obama says a lot of snarky and uncalled for things to Republican members of Congress"

Oooh, you mean like shouting "You lie!" in the middle of one of their speeches? =)

C'mon, debate with me. I'll put this on hold till tomorrow if you gotta sleep first. That's fine. But don't turn tail and run, that's no fun!

Knock me down with your argument skills; give me facts, statements, links, explain why I am mistaken. I'm hoping you can and will attempt to do so; and then, I, in turn, will try and do so for you. This back and forth is why I am here; please?

[aintshesweet-x.livejournal.com]

Yeah, claiming I didn't give facts when I clearly did. It's a typical tactic used mostly by liberals when they don't have facts themselves. They just hope the person they say that to is too dumb to know what they're doing.

Joe Wilson's statement was uncalled for, and I have my own reasons for disliking the Congressman even more (http://twitter.com/CongJoeWilson/status/9146308683). He's not a class act for sure.
Like Obama snarking to McCain that "the election's over!" on several different occasions. Blatantly leaving them out of debates on things like healthcare.

And the debt and deficit, my goodness! We've spent money on a "stimulus package", on healthcare, on a "jobs bill", and so much more, all while planning to raise taxes. The small businesses will get slammed with taxes, and that will hurt them, so they don't grow and ACTUALLY create jobs. Bush was no great bookkeeper either, and I'm not saying he was one.

I may have the 'distinct honor' of living in a state that has has one of the Senate Majority/Minority leaders -- and a lunatic tea partier threatening to be my next junior Senator, which is leading to not so much fun times. So regardless, it's not gonna get much better when and if these tea partiers get elected all over the country. We've had our dose of the far left and we're going to get some of the far right next year, all while the common sense and in touch moderates are retiring or getting defeated.

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

Wait, Obama left republicans out of the debate on healthcare?
Really?

did you miss this? (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/02/07/obama-will-meet-with-repu_n_452790.html)

It is also simultaneously evidence that he can speak w/o a teleprompter.

As for his spending, that doesn't go towards the point about leadership.
Again, reasons to dislike him do not disqualify him from being a leader.

I didn't like Hitler; but to say he wasn't a leader is clearly false.

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

oh, and transcript (http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/remarks-president-gop-house-issues-conference) if you did, somehow, miss that

[aintshesweet-x.livejournal.com]

I believe that is the same event where he snarked at McCain. I watched that on C-SPAN. It was pretty lame. The whole thing. No real effort was put into reaching a consensus or common ground.

edit: NEVERMIND, I see you posted the House version. I'm speaking of the Senate.

Leaders don't recklessly spend like drunken sailors. In short: I think leaders must be humble, open minded, truly work for the people, be effective, and spend responsibly. I don't see Obama doing any of that.

On a side note, I do hate it when the fringe people say Obama is Hitler. I'm Jewish and I do not believe for a freaking 1/1,000th of a millisecond that he is going to do to me what Hitler did to my fellow Jews about forty five or fifty years before I was born. (I'm somewhere in between the ages of 18 and 21 for a ballpark-ish figure.)

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

....You don't wanna give your age? Seriously? At your age? I mean, when your like, 80, sure, it's understandable, but srsly?
Here, I'll go first, I'm 23. I live in NY. Your state is..?

Also: did you finish college fast? Still going? You said you were polli sci, right? I studied philosophy and took some polli sci on the side. Fun stuff. Now for the meat of this.

From the transcript of the event:
McCain is mentioned twice:

1) It's that same spirit of bipartisanship that made it possible for me to sign a defense contracting reform bill that was cosponsored by Senator McCain and members of Congress here today. We've stood together on behalf of our nation's veterans. Together we passed the largest increase in the VA's budget in more than 30 years and supported essential veterans' health care reforms to provide better access and medical care for those who serve in uniform.

2) "Creating a high-risk pool for uninsured folks with preexisting conditions, that wasn't my idea, it was Senator McCain's. And I supported it, and it got incorporated into our approach. Allowing insurance companies to sell coverage across state lines to add choice and competition and bring down costs for businesses and consumers -- that's an idea that some of you I suspect included in this better solutions; that's an idea that was incorporated into our package. And I support it, provided that we do it hand in hand with broader reforms that protect benefits and protect patients and protect the American people"

neither of those are snarky comments aimed at McCain, and the second ones shows, conclusively, that Obama is not passing his agenda w/o listening to the other side. He isn't shutting republicans out, they are willfully becoming the "party of NO" so that, hopefully, Obama will fail and they can reap the rewards. Republicans aren't playing nice, or fair, or even for the best interest of the country. They are playing to win, full stop.

YOU: "I think leaders must be humble, open minded, truly work for the people, be effective, and spend responsibly. I don't see Obama doing any of that."

Well, that's an alright list of traits for a leader; I'm gonna have to say it's incomplete and insufficient, but we can work with that list, so that we have an operational definition.

"spend responsibly" is the up for debate; what makes an expenditure worthwhile? saying "the stimulus was a waste of money" isn't much of an argument (it's an assertion looking for an argument) and The Economist (one of my news sources) doesn't share the GOP talking point that it was a waste of money

"be effective" well, given that Obama got HCR done despite massive difficultues, I'd say he's effective; but this is vague

"truly work for the people" yes, I believe Obama is doing just that. He may not be the leftist I wanted (I dream of single-payer healthcare) but to say he isn't working for the people is going to require some serious justification

"humble and open-minded" can actually be stricken from the list

As we already established, Hitler was a leader. Doesn't matter that he was evil. He was a leader. And he didn't need to be humble and open-minded to be one.

[aintshesweet-x.livejournal.com]

I'm about to pass out and just go into a sleep coma forever, so I think I should get to bed and reply later tomorrow (er, today) - but I will do it! And I'm a Kentuckian since I'm in Eastern time and my Senior Senator is one of the Senate leaders. Heh. Oh joy. The Minority Leader. *bangs head on desk*

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

Sleep well.
When you return (I hope you do) I ask:

You said: "We've had our dose of the far left" a few comments up; I missed that at the time, however I am very curios: what did you mean by that?

I cannot assume you mean Obama, since, he is by no means *far* left. He has been painted that way, but you, a student of political science, should know better than to believe the tar-and-feather campaign that Fox&co are running. Obama isn't much of a leftist, let alone a far leftist.

And I'm still confused why you'd put your age in 18-21 and leave it there? I mean, what, do you talk about drinking on your personal LJ and your worried about it or something? It doesn't matter, tis true, but it's confusing. Since you choose to bring it up in the first place, I find it even more curious that you'd then hide it within such a range.

[xforge.livejournal.com]

Took all the will I have not to shriek something stupid about that "far left." Good grief, if we ever get anyone left much less "far left" in government I will paint myself neon yellow and run down all the streets of Washington screaming I'M A BANANA I'M A BANANA I'M A GODDAMN BANANA.

[thies.livejournal.com]

McKinney 2012

she might beat you on the neon yellow thing though

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

Yeah...tired meme is tired, but people still use it, so I have to keep asking: "really?"

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

so...the pres had a meeting with both the house repubs and the senate repubs...and explicitly stated ideas that were taken *from republicans* and put into the bill, yet he shut them out of debate? huh?

[xforge.livejournal.com]

Guffaw; the healthcare legislation was *written* by Republicans who then promptly refused to vote for it.

[eracerhead.livejournal.com]

I didn't think his Fox talking points would come out so early!