Wow, this is going a bit too far

[dreamville-bg.livejournal.com]

"Last night’s demonstrations across the country have brought some serious activist conversations about Brexit-style separation of the western states." -- DailyKos

Over-raction, a little bit? Or a long-running sentiment on part of the West Coast? Have they felt so disenfranchised by the policies of the rest of the country that they'd want out? I mean, there's the sentiment that the West Coast has had money, business and agriculture siphoned away from them in order to fund the dysfunctional policies of the rest of the country, and moreover, places like Oregon, California and Washington state have a remarkable difference in terms of values from the other states. How true is that, from an insider's perspective (I hope our Californian friends could share some insights here).

It's hardly a surprise that after this election we've seen such support for succession growing. Some people have been advocating for this for years, and now they're joined by others who've never thought of supporting the idea. Is it emotion or a calculated push, now precipitated by Trump's victory? And how possible is it at all? I mean, wouldn't Trump just send the military to squash this pesky rebellion, if it ever existed anywhere beyond the heads of some people? The US wouldn't want to lose access to the Pacific, would it?

On a side note, if these states were to (hypothetically) leave, possibly joined by British Columbia, wouldn't that be yet another serious blow for the Democrats? I mean, those are a lot of liberal votes...

Comments

[abomvubuso.livejournal.com]

What about these guys.

[mutive.livejournal.com]

Provided Jefferson is granted it's own libertarian paradise, I'm sure they'll be content. (Although I feel like they need a floating island or undersea kingdom or something to truly fulfill their dreams.)

[garote]

Hmm so we're talking either Laputa: Castle In The Sky, or The Little Mermaid...
I'm in!!!

[htpcl.livejournal.com]

Anything named La Puta should be awesome!

[mutive.livejournal.com]

I know! Just as long as it doesn't go all Waterworld on us...

[kikzan.livejournal.com]

> The US wouldn't want to lose access to the Pacific, would it?

You should figure that both Oregon & Washington states have access to Pacific.

[dreamville-bg.livejournal.com]

Isn't that exactly what I'm saying?

[garote]

Yeah but San Diego, the port of LA, and San Francisco are collectively 85% of the US's access to the Pacific.

[kikzan.livejournal.com]

NCR/CA will get some revenue from transportation. Like Nitherland's port Rotterdam, who's service all continental states of entire Europe.

[htpcl.livejournal.com]

Yes, and they want to join the secession too.

[kikzan.livejournal.com]

Good luck! I support secession all of democratic states.

[htpcl.livejournal.com]

Yes comrade. I'm sure you do, comrade.

[mutive.livejournal.com]

Californian (well, ex-Californian, now Washingtonian here):

Or a long-running sentiment on part of the West Coast?

Very long running sentiment. I first started hearing it about the time Regan decided to eliminate our military basis as punishment back in the 80s for not voting for him.

Have they felt so disenfranchised by the policies of the rest of the country that they'd want out?

I don't think it'll pass but yes, some people certainly feel this way and, thanks to California's bizarre initiative system, it will almost certainly end up on the ballot. (California also has a long history of arguing with the federal government that it should be treated like its own country, from using their national guard to prevent other Americans from immigrating (http://journals.chapman.edu/ojs/index.php/VocesNovae/article/view/20/94) to tangles with other states over international trade (http://www.hcn.org/articles/how-a-utah-coal-company-fueled-a-secret-plan-to-export-coal-from-california-Keep-It-In-The-Ground-Oakland-terminal).

I mean, there's the sentiment that the West Coast has had money, business and agriculture siphoned away from them in order to fund the dysfunctional policies of the rest of the country, and moreover, places like Oregon, California and Washington state have a remarkable difference in terms of values from the other states. How true is that, from an insider's perspective (I hope our Californian friends could share some insights here).

To be fair, it's true when it comes down to which states pay the most in federal taxes + receive the least. Throw in that the federal government did essentially squat to help in our housing crises (where multiple California cities - from Vallejo to Stockton) went bankrupt, and there definitely is a sense that we're expected to chip in when other states need it, but when we do, tough luck, California, you're on your own.

[garote]

The trouble is that even bluest-of-blue California is still too 'purple' for a secession to really solve it's political problems. All we would really be doing is cutting off the connective federal tissue that binds us with the other big shots like New York, Florida, and Texas. It would also drastically impact our presence on the world stage. Why do what America wants, when you can play California against New York?

[mutive.livejournal.com]

Oh, I agree. I think it's a terrible idea and my guess is will be rejected in a vote. (Rather like the proposal to split California into six states.)

With that said, the rage has existed well prior to this election (to a lesser extent, there's also the Cascadia movement - right now, I believe Calexit doesn't include incorporation of Cascadia, although that could be an interesting twist). And while yes, Trump willing and taking congress with him was, if you will, the tinder, it's not a new concept. It's just one that hasn't gone anywhere and, I suspect, never will.

[oportet.livejournal.com]

Trump can't do anything about it - it isn't his job, yet.... Seems like some higher ups, maybe ones with more influence on the protesters, would speak up. Seems like the side worrying about others accepting the results weren't prepared to accept them themselves....

[policraticus.livejournal.com]

The unpleasantness of 1861-1865 had permanent consequences. If the people of California, or any other state, are interested in revisiting this issue, they are, by right, entitled to try. However, a the member of a family who had experience with the earlier iteration of this sentiment, allow me to discourage my friends in California from pursuing the course my great-great grandparents did. It did not end well for them. Although, it did end well for the nation as a whole.