Armed Teachers Vs Good Sense! Fight!

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2013/01/02/1384531/armed-teacher-training-program/

An Ohio gun owners’ group is launching an “Armed Teacher Training Program” to instruct teachers and school staff on how to shoot off firearms in the classroom.

Perhaps at th outlandish uggestion of the National Rifle Association, who last mont called for armed guards in every school s a response to the tragedy at Sandy Hook elementary, such programs are popping up around the country. In Ohio, the Buckeye Firearms Foundation, along with a group called the Tactical Defense Institute, is crafting a curriculum specifically designed for teachers and school staff. local Fox affiliate as details on who is signing up– they report that more than one third of the applicants are women, and that “more than half of the applicants work in high schools.”


Granted, this is a private organization and what they're doing is totally legal. What this doesn't seem to address is that guns are usually illegal to have a school grounds most places AFAIK. Except for cops, guards and maybe an ROTC officer and other such authority folks. 

But teachers don't fall under that. So anyone who does this program and actually brings a gun to school would still be breaking the law. It's just madness! Hopefully this is just a knee-jerk reaction and people will calm down eventually but it's still very disturbing.

Comments

[brother-dour.livejournal.com]

Hopefully this is just a knee-jerk reaction and people will calm down eventually

Ah, you must be taking about Diane Feinstein...

Also, the Gun-Free Schools Act only applies to students. Teachers and administrators, I believe, are governed by state law. And state law is a total crapshoot.

[telemann.livejournal.com]

Also, the Gun-Free Schools Act only applies to students.

Citation please, because I looked at the act, and there is NO such distinction.

[brother-dour.livejournal.com]

States can exempt people who have a CCL issued by that state, although I do not know if any states have. Presumably, this includes faculty, unless there's a section of the law I'm missing that exempts faculty from the exemption.

[cheezyfish.livejournal.com]

It is illegal for anyone to carry a gun onto school property who doesn't have the school's permission. So, this is partially correct.

[rimpala.livejournal.com]

Welp. gun nuts, you're getting your wish, lets train our teachers to shoot our own children. I need a drink.

[sandwichwarrior.livejournal.com]

I simply can not wrap my head around the idea that you would trust someone to be responsible for other people's children but not trust them to handle a weapon responsibly.

I mean the stakes aren't even on the same continent much less in the same ballpark.

A gun or knife is an inanimate object, as such it almost never does anything unexpected or untoward.

Children on the other hand are prone to both.

[rimpala.livejournal.com]

I don't trust all teachers, some have been caught before for molesting students, and the job is already stressful enough without them having to be trained to kill. But hey what am I going on about anyways, you all won. It's not going to prevent another mass shooting I can see that already, but it doesn't matter because the most important thing is more money in the NRA's pocket.

[fizzyland.livejournal.com]

I'm dubious about trusting many of our cops with guns, I feel much more so towards people with even less professional inclination to be shooters. Yes, any idiot can pull a trigger but it's a rare cat that can do so effectively in a high-stress situation.

[ytterbius.livejournal.com]

Ok, so you don't wrap your head around it, but do you consider it fair for me, as a parent, to be able to (having wrapped my head in a particular way) say that the teachers of my kids are NOT going to be carrying guns at school?

[usekh.livejournal.com]

I cannot wrap my head around the fact that the right in general has spent years denigrating the role of teachers, and their responsibility but now want them armed.

[vitsli.livejournal.com]

Fear is the path to the dark side. Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering. I sense much fear in you.

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

No, you sense the rather questionable meat I had with dinner.

[sandwichwarrior.livejournal.com]

Lo, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death,
I will fear no evil, For thou art with me;

[squidb0i.livejournal.com]

Meanwhile, both sides of this argument completely ignore the source of the problem:

- Shredded social safety nets that allow people to become so desperate or victimized or deranged that they decide to harm others. The US has become a vast experiment in social darwinism.

- The Drug War that props up violent cartels and gangs that commit most crime, particularly violent crime, particularly gun crime. The same Drug War that leads to no knock SWAT raids for pot, to property confiscations, to casual users put in gang run prisons with hardened criminals.

Neither guards at every building and guns in every hand, nor total disarmament will make a damn bit of difference until we address both of those systemic failures.

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

Of course, violent crime has been falling in the US for year. NYC currently has crime levels the same as it had in 1963.

[sandwichwarrior.livejournal.com]

Neither guards at every building and guns in every hand, nor total disarmament will make a damn bit of difference until we address both of those systemic failures.

Which you'd think be apparent anyone with half a clue.

Thus I have to conclude that the majority of gun-control advocates are either A) Clueless, B) Have alterior motives, or C) some combination of the two.

[sandwichwarrior.livejournal.com]

I really don't understand what is so controversial about this.

Disallowing guns in schools clearly hasn't prevented any one from shooting them up so why shouldn't a teacher be allowed to go armed if they so choose?

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

To prevent a teacher from snapping? Or using a weapon to intimidate students? Oh, and then there's whole thing of the gun being stolen.

Guns + school = bad. It's that simple.

[sandwichwarrior.livejournal.com]

Actually you know what.

I'm sick of all this sanctimonious wishy washy bullshit.

The idea was't so crazy when Bill Clinton supported it and funded it (http://articles.latimes.com/2000/apr/16/news/mn-20323). But because Obama cut funding for it (http://www.washingtonguardian.com/washingtons-school-security-failure) so the Idea is "outlandish" now?

Just as Obamacare has nothing to do with health, and cap and trade has nothing to do with global warming, anti-gun laws have nothing to do with saving children’s lives.

It’s just another excuse for those in power to exercise and consolidate that power.

Afterall...

[kylinrouge.livejournal.com]

One conservative response to many proposed liberal ideas is "it's a solution in search of a problem." Well now I flip it back: Arming teachers is a solution in search of a problem.

[candysgirl.livejournal.com]

Indiana has laws on the books stating that anyone with authorization from the school may carry on school property and act as a security guard.

Several of the training schools here in Indianapolis have said that anyone who can show a valid Indiana license to carry a handgun (here its just a license to carry, you can open or conceal carry) and authorization from the school board, they will provide nearly $1000 in free training.

I think it's awesome. All of these shootings take place where the shooter KNOWS there won't be anyone to stop them.

[sophia-sadek.livejournal.com]

The true source of the problem is that God has been evicted from our schools:



The solution: more rosaries and crucifixes in the classroom. Pray, don't spray!

[malakh-abaddon.livejournal.com]

I might, and that is a big might, see this as a possibility, but with all responsibilities and rights there must be some oversight. When I was allowed to carry as a part of my job, I had a lot of things to do. First I had to have a Psychological evaluation, to make sure that I was competent enough to carry, and also as a way to determine if I was "trigger happy". Next, I had a gun safety course, with a law enforcement officer (State Trooper or equivalent in job), who is currently employed in that field, with this must be a proficiency test, with a range of handgun. In my classes I had state troopers sit in, and both times had to use separate handguns each time, both provided by the teacher. Next I had a defensive gun use class, well several of them, as an attempt to prepare me for using a firearm, this time the class was sat in by a WV Bureau of Investigations trainer. Along the way, I had negotiation courses, other self defense classes, and spent some time training with state troopers. After that, out of fifty people ten made the cut. We were then bonded against property damage, loss of life (intentional and accidental), and several other things, as I recall, without looking at my bonding paperwork, it was up to five million dollars. We were also required to produce the firearm so it could be logged, acquire a concealed carry permit, and spend at least an hour on range weekly, with bi-monthly proficiency tests, and firearm inspections by a independent gunsmith, we could not pick a smith to inspect our weapon and produce the report. I elected to use their gunsmith for purchases, and maintenance, which was allowed.

If those conditions were met, I might be more open to teachers and staff carrying a firearm in schools.

[malakh-abaddon.livejournal.com]

One thing I did not mention about my time with the State Police training was that we took time to learn how to properly clear a building, and basically how to deal with people without shooting first. I was a fan of that aspect.

[squidb0i.livejournal.com]

Terrible idea is terrible.

More police/security is fine if the money doesn't come out of the education budget, but we're talking about defending against something as rare as being struck by lightning.