[identity profile] sophia-sadek.livejournal.com posting in [community profile] talkpolitics
Just as there is no single brand of civilization, there is also no single brand of barbarism. In the ancient world any alien civilization that did not conform to local customs was seen as barbarous. The Greeks considered Carthage to be barbarous for practicing human sacrifice. The people of Carthage may have reciprocated with a perception of the Greeks as primitive pederasts. Greece looked to Egypt for leadership in cultural advancement as Israel looked away from Babylon.

The people considered most barbarous by the ancient Greeks were nomadic plains tribes north of the Black Sea. The description of their lifestyle resembles that of some Native Americans at the time of the European invasion. Unlike the "civilized" Greeks, the Scythians had no apparent urban center. They roamed the plains taxing the local peasants for grain to export to Greece. They lived a life of land piracy. The peasants who fell victim to Scythian depredations were not worthy of mention in Greek literature, just as the slaves who labor away for the American chocolate market remain invisible to most Americans.

By the time Rome had reached its Zenith the Scythians had been displaced by a population of Nordic barbarians. They too practiced piracy, but it was mostly against Greek settlements on the Black Sea. Gothic raiders in Greece resembled their Viking cousins to come centuries later.

The Goths were converted to Christianity by heretics at a time when heresy was the norm. This conversion was not considered complete until they eventually succumbed to the oppression of the Trinity. We can get a good idea of heretical Gothic culture from the description of the Gothic occupation of Rome in the works of Procopius. Most Orthodox writers tended to focus on atrocities committed during the Gothic invasion. Procopius shows a different aspect of Gothic culture as it fell to the forces of Justinian and Orthodoxy.

Procopius describes the Gothic women as "manly." They spat on their own men during the surrender of Rome. This image alone speaks volumes about the difference in ethos between Greco-Roman "civilization" and the barbarian invaders who eventually occupied its territory. It shows us why those who romanticize Rome also demonize feminism. From the Barbarian perspective their own men had become soft and weak. Living a life of luxury in Rome had taken away their will to stand up to Orthodox despotism. They had been emasculated by the dark force of opulence.
(deleted comment)

(no subject)

Date: 24/4/12 16:13 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fizzyland.livejournal.com
Don't blame the Greeks for that, blame the guyliner.

(no subject)

Date: 24/4/12 17:30 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com
Ironically to the Rhomanians, Hellenismos was a culture of vulgar sex-addicted pagans, neither to be emulated nor encouraged.
(deleted comment)

(no subject)

Date: 25/4/12 17:50 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com
....

Byzantium saved all those Hellenistic manuscripts Islam and the West used for their philosophy.

(no subject)

Date: 24/4/12 17:29 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com
Rome made the Barbarian in their own image and in their own likeness. A lot of that Roman "ethnography" was really a not-very-thinly veiled complaint by reactionaries against the cultural traditions of their own time. For their part the Barbarians *wanted* to become Roman as that was the local civilization but they were never fully counted. Unlike China and India, Western civilization has never really had a means to "integrate" short of wholesale annihilation and destruction of a group and the forced conversion of its shattered remnants.

(no subject)

Date: 24/4/12 19:04 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] devil-ad-vocate.livejournal.com
All civilizations had/have their share of what others considered barbarism - without exception.

(no subject)

Date: 26/4/12 07:07 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] htpcl.livejournal.com
No one does.

Credits & Style Info

Talk Politics.

A place to discuss politics without egomaniacal mods

DAILY QUOTE:
"The NATO charter clearly says that any attack on a NATO member shall be treated, by all members, as an attack against all. So that means that, if we attack Greenland, we'll be obligated to go to war against ... ourselves! Gee, that's scary. You really don't want to go to war with the United States. They're insane!"

March 2026

M T W T F S S
       1
2345 678
910 1112 1314 15
1617 1819 202122
23242526272829
3031