Civil disobedience is breaking the law.

[meus-ovatio.livejournal.com]

I hate to break it to a lot of folks around here, but civil disobedience is, yes, breaking the law. I know, I know, it's a terribly shocking and terrifying concept to grasp- I mean, disobeying the law? That's anarchy! The very fabric of our existence is at stake! But, you know, it sort of happens, and you know, history goes on and nations somehow manage to survive that scourge of anarchist disobedience from time to time. Who knows how nations soldier on in the face of such demonic lawlessness? This is a mystery of God I suppose.

But given this most basic of historical lessons, and given the rather hysterical remonstrations of civil conviviality and order going about like some kind of cheap move popcorn, I thought people might need to be reminded of this social reality extant throughout time and geography.

But, it's ok. I'm here to tell you that it will be ok. Don't give up hope, the sanctity and vitality of the sacred bonds of city ordinances shall persevere in this darkest of days. The common bonds of humanity and municipality shall triumph over the short-sighted recklessness of the dastardly few. We can take comfort in this. We can warm our hearts with this.

Do not give up hope my fellow social savants. There shall be friendship, and commerce and orderly relations duly regulated by the appointed authorities. We need not worry so much about these things.

Comments

[policraticus.livejournal.com]

Civil disobedience is breaking the law.

Obvious point is obvious. But if going to jail was good enough for Thoreau, it should be good enough for the OWS crowd. Having the courage of your convictions, being a member of the revolutionary vanguard, challenging the conscience of the people, giving voice to the voiceless, hope to the hopeless, comforting the afflicted, afflicting the comfortable and damning "the Man," means that you will occasionally get pepper sprayed. Just be thankful this isn't Czarist Russia. Or even Russia, for that matter.

[meus-ovatio.livejournal.com]

But if going to jail was good enough for Thoreau, it should be good enough for the OWS crowd.
I'm not following the logic here. What is conclusive about Thoreau?

Just be thankful this isn't Czarist Russia. Or even Russia, for that matter.
Oh I'm sure people are "thankful" in that innate sort of way, whereby people understand that they are in one place and not another. But what does that have to do with it?

[policraticus.livejournal.com]

Thoreau wrote the book on civil disobedience. It was called, Civil Disobedience. In it he is pretty clear that the goal is not to get away with the law breaking but rather to not get away with it. It is to have ones (unjust) punishment be a shock to the conscience of the community and prompt a change in the law.

Civil disobedience of the Thoreau/Ghandi/MLK variety depends on the unwillingness of society to just let the government kill people willy-nilly. Ghandi only got to be Ghandi because he was dealing with the Great Britain of Louis Mountbatten and not Lord Clyde.

[allisnow.livejournal.com]

Raging against the machine just isn't as fun when there's consequences for your actions. :(

[badlydrawnjeff.livejournal.com]

I nominate this for a DQ. Nice chuckle.

[mrbogey.livejournal.com]

Thoreau is kind of a bad example as he went to jail but got out when someone else paid his fines and taxes. His courage of conviction only extended to his purse.

[enders-shadow.livejournal.com]

I haven't seen a lot of people getting super pissed off that police are arresting people.

I'm pretty sure it's the police VIOLENCE that gets people angry.

Fuck. I was arrested for protesting and you don't see me complaining about that.
It's the needless use of force that grinds my gears.

[pastorlenny.livejournal.com]

Just be thankful this isn't Czarist Russia. Or even Russia, for that matter.

That kinda works both ways.

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

That would be the Tsarist Russia where there was a revolution in 1825, the first modern forms of terrorism, and that ultimately fell to a popular revolution in March? Bad analogy.

Re: Should go to jail for civil disobedience part 2

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

I'm sure you understand the difference between doing something with or without a permit...so are you just baiting?

[pastorlenny.livejournal.com]

But what if people start speeding -- or engage in cash transactions to avoid taxes?

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

pepper spray.

[meus-ovatio.livejournal.com]

I hope we need not contemplate such dark things in our lifetimes.

[mrbogey.livejournal.com]

'I hate to break it to a lot of folks around here, but civil disobedience is, yes, breaking the law'

Yes.

I have no clue why most OWS supporters don't realize this. They practice civil disobedience but believe the cops are assholes for arresting them. D'uh. That's the whole point. You're supposed to be arrested as to take a stand. Make society either force you or to repeal the laws you're protesting.

The problem with OWS is they don't realize that they're not popular enough as to get people to abandon a free market system for a socialist/communist system where the gov't controls the financial system. So till they give up they'll just keep on getting arrested and beaten for resisting.

And they'll keep on getting frustrated when they get arrested because they think that civil disobedience is not against the law.

[hikarugenji.livejournal.com]

Not everyone who sympathizes with OWS wants to see socialism or communism, or the government in control of the financial system.

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

None of them advocate centralized planning done by the state, imprisonment and execution of class enemies, or a one-party system. Hell, 99% of them wouldn't know how to pronounce the term proletariat, much less what it means. Perhaps if OWS critics found an analogy appropriate to the 2010s as opposed to the 1950s.....

[devil-ad-vocate.livejournal.com]

I read an article today about a big PR firm approaching Wall Street - offering to mount a campaign against OWS. There was much discussion in the comments section about the whys, wherefores, and the usual "police-car pooping". The one comment that struck me was:

"You folk won't get it until they eat you."

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

[stewstewstewdio.livejournal.com]

This is a mystery of God I suppose.

I guess God protects his own, whoever they are...

(http://pics.livejournal.com/stewstewstewdio/pic/00062wcd/)

[mrbogey.livejournal.com]

WBC is law-abiding to the book. That's why they get away with all of their protests. The family actually studied the law extensively and they rarely get in trouble for breaking it.

[unnamed525.livejournal.com]

It doesn't matter. Even if it is illegal, that doesn't mean it's immoral or unethical.

[sandwichwarrior.livejournal.com]

Well that's the point. You may be right but don't get butt hurt when the cops show up to do their thing.