(no subject)

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

http://www.nation.co.ke/Features/lifestyle/Flying+Kenya+business+flag+in+South+Korea+/-/1214/1255704/-/item/0/-/bx57syz/-/index.html

One fine morning, pandemonium broke out in a South Korean supermarket, and customers and shop stewards alike scampered for safety. Babies strapped on their mothers’ backs, others in prams screamed as their parents sought the nearest exits. And it wasn’t a terrorist attack, neither was it a band of robbers who had raided the convenience store. No, it wasn’t a
fire alert either. One Kenyan woman had just walked in to make a purchase.

“It was terrible!” recalls the woman, Everlyne Nyambegera. “Children were crying, their mothers dashing for the exits and all this made me also break down and start crying too.”


As a resident of South Korea who lives only about an hour from Seoul I do have to say I was surprised by this. Korea being what it is a lot of people here don't have much experience in dealing with foreigners. However, there are lot of foreigners in Seoul. The US Army has a base in town and there's Itaewon, an area that is pretty the foreigner district.

That said, some people here still get very weirded out around foreigners; especially black people. In any case, this is still a really shocking reaction to see and when it made the news some of the other expats and I got to talking about it and the old debate among expats in places like this came up yet again: Was the situation xenophobia or racism?

Among expats this also seems to turn into the people who excuse everything with xenophobia and the people who blame everything on racism. Personally, I think it's had to make that sort of call if you weren't there. I've more or less gotten used to people being weirded out by my being a foreigner and in the over three years I've spent in Asia and can only think of a handful of times when people really demonstrated they didn't like be because I wasn't one of them.

So here is the questions I put to you: Where is the line between xenophobia and racism? What, if anything, can the law do to protect people from the latter?

Comments

[pastorlenny.livejournal.com]

There is not a line between xenophobia and racism. It's more of a Venn diagram.

[raichu100.livejournal.com]

This is kind of what I was thinking. They're closely related.

[taiki.livejournal.com]

The law can keep people from being denied jobs, housing, food, etc. You can legislate that people do have the right to the essentials to live.

Separating xenophobia and racism is tricky because the nature of race itself is tricky. Is a polish joke racist or xenophobic? They're just as white and european as many Americans are.

I think fumbling over terminology is kind of selfdefeating, but we need to make sure it doesn't happen and establish better terms.

[meus-ovatio.livejournal.com]

I think it grew as people were reacting to other people reacting and panic ensues, and it was that one original fucker who panicked, throwing everyone else into a panic.

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

That's my thought as well given what hard animals people can be.

[paedraggaidin.livejournal.com]

I would say that xenophobia = racism.

[devil-ad-vocate.livejournal.com]

If there weren't such a thing as nuance, the Inuit would only have one word for snow.

[anfalicious.livejournal.com]

The Innuit have quite few words for snow, about the same as English. The Sami have hundreds.

[devil-ad-vocate.livejournal.com]

Got me there... after I made the comment, I looked it up on Wiki. Damn. Sometimes I think half of what I know is probably a myth.

[badlydrawnjeff.livejournal.com]

More that all racists are probably xenophobes, but not all xenophobes are racist. Intent matters.

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

What if the people in question are the same race?

[mintogrubb.livejournal.com]

Ah - but is racial difference always behind Xenophbia? Some people who are in no way noticeably anatomically or genetically different to the Irish or Polish immigrant do not actually like these people.

Of course, there is a big overlap sometimes between the cultural difference and the genetic difference between two groups, but this is nothing to hate people for.
To me, the colour of your skin makes as much difference as the colour of your eyes.

I think this incident goes to show that it isn't true that 'only whites are racist'.

[soliloquy76.livejournal.com]

Technically speaking, xemophobia is the fear of foreigners, while racism is considering your race superior to another and worthy of discrimination. I'd say that makes the line pretty clear.

[anfalicious.livejournal.com]

Pretty much, and this is where the intent Jeff mentions above comes in. It can be hard to see the difference on the surface, however. That's why the law isn't necessarily the best tool the state has to combat it.

[mikeyxw.livejournal.com]

It's not that clear in Asia where, for the most part, a foreigner is used to describe someone of a different race.

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

Ah, but how do you tell which another is feeling towards you?

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

If they make dehumanizing assumptions about you based on race it's racism. If they don't like you because "You aint from around here" its xenophobia. If they have decided you aren't from around there because of your race, whether or not you're from around there, it's racist xenophobia.

[soliloquy76.livejournal.com]

Well, in the case you highlighted, the crying and running away seems like a clear case of xenophobia to me. :P

[mintogrubb.livejournal.com]

Agreed.

[anfalicious.livejournal.com]

Something the state can do without laws is education and tolerance programmes. They've been successful here; 30 years ago it wouldn't be surprising to hear that story coming out of Australia.

[luzribeiro.livejournal.com]

Is it really November 7 at your place?

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

Actually my computer clock was off and I didn't notice until this morning.

[harry-beast.livejournal.com]

Strictly speaking, if it committed by white people, it is racism; if not, we shouldn't rush to judgment based on cultural imperialism.
Personally, I think it is crap to soft pedal this sort of thing. I don't expect that the distinction between xenophobia and racism much matters to Everlyne Nyambegera or to anyone else on the receiving end.
As far as what the law can do, there are limits to regulating interpersonal interactions. What is needed is leadership. Social and political leaders should persuade the population to be more open minded though education, public discourse and measures to bring to light and address this problem.

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

Cry moar, there's plenty of examples of non-white racism toward other races....where the holders of power aren't white themselves. Robert Mugabe is a racist dick, and his skin color has nothing to do with it. Any country that allows for institutional discrimination based on race is racist, the race in political power in this regard matters not.

[lilenth.livejournal.com]

Robert Mugabe is an equal opportunities dick actually, he's playing both sides off each other for his own ends. A starving fighting populace aren't going to unite and kick his ass out of power.

Also it hasn't been long since Apartheid ended, it only stopped in 94. 15 years isn't long enough to make major changes or for people to forget the Apartheid especially since Robert Mugabe was one of the people who helped overthrow it, so he does have reason to be dicks to Whites beyond his own interests, White south Africans were oppressing other races pretty badly.

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

However he did confiscate the lands of white people for no reason other than that they were white, regardless of whether they supported Ian Smith's regime or not. Had he limited it to Smith supporters it'd be just plain revenge and not racist dickery, unfortunately for Zimbabwe Mugabe was never so capable of limiting what he did like this.

Apartheid was in South Africa, Mugabe was involved in the Rhodesian Bush War, two completely different elements of the same evil beast that was the African British Empire. Mugabe was in power in Zimbabwe long before Apartheid fell.

[lilenth.livejournal.com]

No, it was because those farms were producing cash crops not food to feed the people.

Check your facts.

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

Interesting. Got any links on this?

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

Yup, it's both racism and a particularly stupid and inexcusable variety of racism at that. When the majority, dominant ethnicity/culture is non-white, racism can certainly also be non-white as that meets the power part of power + prejudice.

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

I will give you a dollar if you try and sell that in SF_Drama.

It is not just Korea.

[sophia-sadek.livejournal.com]

That is pretty much how many Americans reacted when they heard that Obama won the presidency.

Re: It is not just Korea.

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

As opposed to those who pretty much danced in the streets.

Re: It is not just Korea.

[sophia-sadek.livejournal.com]

Exactly. One group danced in the streets and another went screaming for the emergency exit doors.

Re: It is not just Korea.

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

But which was the majority?

Re: It is not just Korea.

[sophia-sadek.livejournal.com]

Neither. There was a third group of people who neither celebrated nor wrung their hands.

[onefatmusicnerd.livejournal.com]

Sweet, "Crash" is my favorite pre-derby practice song!

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

A fondness for it is one of the few good things to come from the time I watched "Dumb and Dumber."

[lilenth.livejournal.com]

Xenophobia is the fear of those not like you, racism is power plus prejudice against those who are not like you. Ergo, Xenophobia can drive racism because it's a prejudicial fear.

The incident was Xenophobia, not racism.

The law can enforce legal penalties on those who treat people differently on the basis of race, sexuality, gender, sex or any other difference.

[dv8nation.livejournal.com]

And just which race do you think runs the show in Korea? Because if it's white people then someone forgot to send me the memo.