fridi: (Default)
[personal profile] fridi posting in [community profile] talkpolitics
For those who still wonder why Trump has taken the shocking decision to recognize Jerusalem as Israel's capital, despite overwhelming opposition from almost anywhere in the world (Britain, France, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, the Palestinians, the UN, the Pope, etc), do bear in mind what his strategy has been since day one of the election campaign.

He thrives on division. Being a radical, he needs to ignite his radical base, evangelicals in this case. They expect the fulfillment of the prophesy that the Messiah will sit on the throne of David in Jerusalem, and this can happen only if Jerusalem is controlled by Israel. Pence's presence during Trump's speech was no coincidence, he stood solemn but prominent in the background, as if to tacitly state who's backing the decision. And it's no coincidence that Trump has repeatedly invoked "Judeo-Christian" when referring to the United States. It's been a consistent theme for him, even if he's not necessarily a Christian fundie.

Trump is not only expecting the chaos that his decision will create, he's actually inviting it. Divide and rule. He's betting on white Christian Americans being pitted against everyone else, and in this context, this move regarding Jerusalem is logical. Religious conflicts, like racial and ethnic ones, are critical to his appeal.

That, and the inevitable distraction that this act is going to provide away from hiw increasing woes back home.

He needs conflict, so that his radical supporters can be kept active. He knows the reaction, particularly in the Middle East, will be swift and violent. But that's exactly what he wants. He needs Mexian Americans to rape and murder white girls. He needs African American athletes to "disrespect the flag". He needs Muslims to explode bombs and burn American flags. The more threatening non-white, non-Christians appear, the more his supporters would rely on him to keep the barbarians at bay. If he has to invent these dangers, he will. And just like in this, case he'll even help create them.

(no subject)

Date: 7/12/17 08:02 (UTC)
abomvubuso: (Groovy Kol)
From: [personal profile] abomvubuso
The US actually recognised Jerusallem as Israel's capital as far back as 1995 (the Jerusallem Embassy Act). It's just that Trump has now decided to stop chewing the issue and postponing it over and over. Why now? Well, you got a point about the timing. It's a distraction.

(no subject)

Date: 8/12/17 01:55 (UTC)
oportet: (Default)
From: [personal profile] oportet
'Thanks Trump!' can now replace 'Thanks Obama!' - why wasn't this a problem 6 months ago when recognizing Jerusalem as Israels capital won out (again) 90-0 in the senate?

(no subject)

Date: 8/12/17 05:42 (UTC)
asthfghl: (Слушам и не вярвам на очите си!)
From: [personal profile] asthfghl
I guess the whole world doesn't care about the US Senate, which is one among several sub-branches of the legislative establishment. As opposed to the executive actions of the head of state of the most influential country in the world, whose decisions put into effect events and processes affecting places in every corner of the world.

That, or the whole world harbors a partisan love for US Democrats for some reason.

Which could it be? Occam, where are you when we need you?

(no subject)

Date: 8/12/17 13:46 (UTC)
oportet: (Default)
From: [personal profile] oportet
Both can be true. Maybe not the whole world - but a good portion; you know there'd be parties and parades if Obama did this.

(no subject)

Date: 8/12/17 14:42 (UTC)
asthfghl: (А бе къде е батко?)
From: [personal profile] asthfghl
Don't forget the Nobel peace prizes.

(no subject)

Date: 9/12/17 02:46 (UTC)
halialkers: An image of Joe Stalin in sunglasses with the phrase "Broseph Stalin" on it (Kaartshaahin Heshatani)
From: [personal profile] halialkers
Based on the selective appearance of hundreds of thousand strong protesters in Paris and London only when Republicans are in office, Occam's makes a pretty strong reaction that Democratic Presidents since LBJ aren't seen with the impending nightmare Republicans are seen with good reason as representing. Did Mr. Obama's war in Yemen or Mr. Clinton's war in Iraq get protests like the lead-in to Mr. Bush's war in 2003? If they did I sure missed when that happened in Paris, London, Rome, and other *European* cities.

(no subject)

Date: 9/12/17 06:36 (UTC)
asthfghl: (А бе къде е батко?)
From: [personal profile] asthfghl
The way you missed the anti Russia rage, eh, sport? ;-)

(no subject)

Date: 9/12/17 21:15 (UTC)
halialkers: Mao Zedong smiling with caption "ROFLMAO" (ROFLMAO)
From: [personal profile] halialkers
There were crowds from 300,000 to half a million strong protesting Mr. Bush's war. Mr. Clinton's and Mr. Obama's wars got bupkiss from the global Left and his Yemen war had a case of media goldfish sydrome Trump's appears to have inherited. It's not a strawman to note massive crowds have partisan willingness to show up and decide US idiotic damn fool crusades in the Middle East are global threats.

Bush's Iraq War leveled what Saddam hadn't quite managed to ruin and destabilized the region and that got plenty of entirely valid protests. Where were those massive crowds of Europeans when Obama's war risked a global nuclear war over Russian habits of blowing up American allies and American threats to shoot Russian planes down?

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Date: 8/12/17 14:13 (UTC)
oportet: (Default)
From: [personal profile] oportet
On why he did it?

Maybe distraction, like the first comment said, or maybe a favor to Pence, like you hinted at (because I doubt Trump really cares where the capital of Israel is or isn't).

On the reaction? I don't get it - it's already known the U.S. considers Jerusalem the capital. Right or wrong, it's old news. The only difference is - Trump said it out loud - making me think people (in the US and around the world) don't have a problem with what was said, just with who said it.






(no subject)

Date: 8/12/17 14:54 (UTC)
oportet: (Default)
From: [personal profile] oportet
Why wasn't this a problem when the Senate said Jerusalem was Israels capital? Why wasn't a problem when Bill Clinton, W., and Obama all said the exact same thing?

They aren't Trump - that is the only difference I can spot. Am I missing something else?

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Date: 11/12/17 07:41 (UTC)
airiefairie: (Default)
From: [personal profile] airiefairie
OK, but why do it at all? There was no real pressure from the Israeli government, neither back home to do such a thing. Why the unilateral, one-sided decision that gives everything to Israel and nothing to the Palestinians? How is this a position of a mediator?

(no subject)

Date: 8/12/17 22:14 (UTC)
nairiporter: (Default)
From: [personal profile] nairiporter
If anything, Trump does have this talent of bringing the whole world together... against himself. :-)

Indeed...

Date: 9/12/17 02:15 (UTC)
telemann: (Default)
From: [personal profile] telemann
Bigley talent.

(no subject)

Date: 9/12/17 06:40 (UTC)
kiaa: (Default)
From: [personal profile] kiaa
Also, any criticism of Trump's foreign policy by foreigners has the potential to suddenly and magically unite Americans behind him. ;)

(no subject)

Date: 9/12/17 02:41 (UTC)
halialkers: Super-suit, Raven white outfit, no belt, cloud of smoke around her (Comics!Raven6)
From: [personal profile] halialkers
That and he wants to give red meat to his base. Added to this his Nazi-style sympathies and a move that gives Israel a poisoned chalice that makes it more vulnerable and alienated is only a good thing so he kills multiple birds with a boulder.

(no subject)

Date: 9/12/17 06:51 (UTC)
nairiporter: (Default)
From: [personal profile] nairiporter
Are you OK with his move? I couldn't discern this from any of your comments so far.

(no subject)

Date: 9/12/17 21:19 (UTC)
halialkers: (Angron)
From: [personal profile] halialkers
I oppose it because it's a damn fool stupid decision that will further destabilize an already-dangerous set of issues between Syria and the budding Israel-Arab coalition against Iran. It will do no good and incalculable harm. I see it as overt appealing to the US religious fundamentalist lobby and to America's home-grown Nazis, and nothing of that combination is ever good.

(no subject)

Date: 9/12/17 16:45 (UTC)
asthfghl: (Ауди А6 за шес' хиляди марки. Проблемче?)
From: [personal profile] asthfghl
Like a Macedonian would say, I really don't get the whole quarrel for Jerusalem. Everyone knows it's an ancient Macedonian settlement. Just like the Moon.

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