Comparing the Left protestors to the Right

[verytwistedmind.livejournal.com]

The Left/G20:

Pittsburgh public safety officials say 83 people were arrested at protests and other events during the Group of 20 summit and about $50,000 in property damage was done

Police say a man who smashed windows at a Citizens Bank branch in the city's Oakland section was responsible for $20,000 in damage.
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5izJGY1GNeNYgNG6q1N0bsXCVfBeAD9AUOGVG0

The Right/9-12 rally:
Washington D.C. was not the only place to protest an out of control government. It has been reported that over 800 tea parties took place in cities and towns from New Hampshire to New Mexico, Texas to Tennessee, and Ohio to Oregon

As many as one million people flooded into Washington for a massive rally organised by conservatives claiming that President Obama is driving America towards socialism

**I was unable to find any examples of property damage and arrests**
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1213056/Up-million-march-US-Capitol-protest-Obamas-spending-tea-party-demonstration.html


Why isn't Nancy Pelosi getting all choked up about this like she was about the other protests? Where is the outcry about the state of the Republic when actual violent protest occur? Last week there was a post on here blaming the death of a fed on Right Wing retoric. We had no evidence of that we can only speculate. Here we have evidence of violence, we know who the protesters were, and what their beliefs are, yet not uproar or outrage.

The G-20 is a true example of an 'angry mob' yet I found no articles calling them such in a Google search with . Google Heathcare town hall and mob you find six hundred thousand links.

Comments

[debergerac.livejournal.com]

this should be good...

[kko.livejournal.com]

astroturf

[a-new-machine.livejournal.com]

I'd wager novelty. If you remember, the Seattle protests were big news, but that was how long ago now? The "tea party" movement is still relatively new.

[tridus.livejournal.com]

The really strange thing about the G20 protests is that most of the people there either don't know what they're protesting, or don't agree on the slightest on it. It's a nebulous protest more about protesting the government then about any real issue. As such, it tends to draw in a lot of people who are just looking for an excuse to cause trouble.

The other protest on the other hand is about something. From what I've seen, a lot of people there don't really understand the issue terribly well (though some do), but they've got specific issues they're protesting against. As a result, the demographic that showed up is pretty different and less prone to vandalism.

[weswilson]

I find it really amusing that you think the town hall protesters "understand the issue terribly well".

[weswilson]

Perhaps it's because nobody think that the G20 protesters are anything BUT an angry mob. The media treats town hall protesters like mainstream and G20 protesters like dirty hippies. If the media and the common man treated town hall protesters the way they treat Code Pink, then I doubt there would have been any rejection of them.

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

That is the best rationalization I've heard yet.

[majortom-thecat.livejournal.com]

The extreme left likes to break windows. The extreme right likes to break people.

[verytwistedmind.livejournal.com]

Clever, but I see no evidence of that. In fact, I see the opposite. Nancy Pelosi was breaking people verbally, calling them angry mobs. The first to compare them to nazis....

The extreme right broke nothing, none of the extreme right was arrested and there was a million of them.

[reflaxion.livejournal.com]

How is the G-20 a "left" thing? I mean, I don't know if anyone told you, but one of our guys was in there.

[thies.livejournal.com]

I thought it had been found that the 9/12 numbers were exaggerated by roughly a factor or 10

I disagree I counted the heads

[verytwistedmind.livejournal.com]

http://iowntheworld.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/capitol-view-lo-res.jpg


http://michellemalkin.com/2009/09/12/celebrating-the-912-rallies/

The claim that only tens of thousands of people attended has been disputed by photographic evidence.

http://209.157.64.201/focus/f-news/2344124/posts

For a fair comparison, we looked at the Saturday after Labor Day in 2008, which is when September 12 fell in 2009. On September 12, 2009, 437,624 rode metro rail. By comparison, on the Saturday after Labor Day in 2008, 202,528 rode. The difference is 235,096. Even if nobody else came to the March, and we know they did by chartered bus and by carpool, the theory that only 70,000 people were there is off by roughly 335% - debunking the 70,000 claim. To take it a step further for comparison, we also looked at the attendance for President Obama’s Inauguration in January 2009. Convential wisdom estimates that attendance for the inaugural was between 800,000 and 1.8 million, or an average of 1.3 million. If you compare Metro riders on Martin Luther King Day 2008, the similarly situated federal holiday in January to the Inauguration in 2009, approximately 975,000 additional people rode metro for the Inauguration. If you compare 975,000 additional metro riders as a percentage of the 1.3 million total who attended and you do the same for 235,000 additional metro riders for the 9/12 March, than at least 313,000 went downtown for the explicit purpose of marching against out-of-control government spending on September 12. This assumes a similar percentage of attendees took buses, cabs, drove in, walked, etc.
http://209.157.64.201/focus/f-news/2344124/posts

I think a million is closer to accurate than tens of thousand.

[policraticus.livejournal.com]

If you look at the time lapse of the 9/12 march up Pennsylvania Blvd. you will see the entire length from Freedom to 3rd Street is full of marching people. I went on Google Earth and did some measuring. That space is about 5000 feet by 150 feet. Using a National Park Service estimate of 1 person per 5 square feet in a loose crowd that yields 150,000, just on the street, not counting those already around the Capitol or still back in the plaza or on the Mall. Apparently, the marchers filled the area around the Capitol. That area is judged by the NPS to hold about 275,000 people for inaugurations. The picture on iowntheworld above shows this was more or less the case, plus some more up the mall and around. I'd say 250,000 is a very conservative estimate. Not 1 million, to be sure, but a lot more than the 75,000 bandied about in the wake of the protest

[prog-expat.livejournal.com]

The 60K estimate was just for Lafayette Park (http://newsroom.dc.gov/show.aspx/agency/fems/section/2/release/18165).

[sgiffy.livejournal.com]

As many as one million people flooded into Washington for a massive rally organised by conservatives claiming that President Obama is driving America towards socialism

Haha there wasn't anywhere near that number. Try 60-70 thousand.

As for why there was more damage, I would think it would have a lot to do with the age of the crowds mostly. Personally I am much more concerned with the blatant racism, fear-mongering, and general dumbassery coming out of the teabaggers than I am a few angry kids smashing a couple windows.

[verytwistedmind.livejournal.com]

Of course, mean words and 'racism' are much much worse than destruction of property and arrests. That makes...no I can't even be facetious that's terrible logic.

[retrofire.livejournal.com]

agent provocateurs - they are the ones who disguise their identities at protests and incite violence. This is followed by mass arrests.

This talks about it. (http://www.prisonplanet.com/provocateur-cops-caught-disguised-as-anarchists-at-g20.html)

Perhaps there were agent provocateurs at the tea bagger protests. I got the impression that those protest signs that said "Youth in Asia" had to be outsiders trying to make republicans look stupid - because republicans could not possibly be that stupid, could they?

In conclusion, the right incites violence at leftist protests, and the left makes cute little signs to mock republican stupidity and righty protests.

[debergerac.livejournal.com]

so the real anarchists are peace-loving protestors who don't cause any trouble but merely carry stupid little signs?

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

I think the fact that there were no arrests and no damage proves that the whole thing didn't happen. It was just a fantasy of right wing radio.
(pretty cool how they did all the fake footage)

[verytwistedmind.livejournal.com]

The vast right wing conspiracy strikes again! They are like ninjas! No better than ninjas!

What's better than a ninja?

[prog-expat.livejournal.com]

G8/G20 protestors are not all left-wingers. Libertarian and paleoconservative (http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/news/pittsburgh/s_640277.html) protestors routinely show up at these events, too. The summits also attract a lot of anarchist protestors — who don't really fit into the left-right spectrum — such as David Jopenga, who's being charged with 40% of the property damage.

For your argument to be valid, you'll first need to demonstrate that property damage was caused by demonstrably left-wing protestors.

[policraticus.livejournal.com]

The difference was that the marchers at the 9/12 protest were probably, on average, 15-20 years older than those protesting the G-20. They were also more likely to be employed or to own their own business. They were also more likely to be parents. All of them were taxpayers. All of this mitigates against violence and vandalism. They had something to lose and respect for things that other people had worked hard to achieve.

[http://users.livejournal.com/-xaipe-/]

Yeah, this is basically what I was thinking too. In general, college-age people are more volatile than older folks who showed up for the 9/12 protest. I don't know if it has so much to do with "more to lose," but I do think it has a lot to do with their ages and life stages.

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

Fringe protesters vs fairly mainstream protesters. If you haven't noticed, the mainstream left supports Obama who happened to be part of the damned thing. Are you trolling or what?

[prog-expat.livejournal.com]

It's verytwistedmind, of course he's trolling.

[bebopmonkey.livejournal.com]

I think there are two problems with this "issue" you present.

1. Property Damage is terrible and senseless, and is perpetrated by a few extremists. Just like right wing extremists (only they use guns). BUT, no one on the left is crying out "smash the state." no one credible anyways. but um... Glenn Beck anyone?

2. This whole march was inspired by the Right's fear-mongering. Most people there were woefully misinformed. Just look at the signs they carried.

Health Care Reform is not about changing your insurance or taking it away. It's about providing greater access and controlling costs. Hence this whole issue of "how many people were really there omg?!?!?!" is a red herring. It is in fact, a sad commentary on how poorly informed and reactionary the right wing is..

To conclude, I bet you that at least 80% of the people at that protest will benefit from public insurance, whether through being able to afford to buy it for themselves or though reduced costs.

[majortom-thecat.livejournal.com]

Were you there?

[malasadas.livejournal.com]

You've discovered something amazing:

Nobody takes a mob of 18-22 year old Trustafarian brats who have no major media figures extolling their virtues or members of Congress congratulating them for their patriotism all that seriously.