[identity profile] tcpip.livejournal.com posting in [community profile] talkpolitics
“Two Turkish pilots were captured by the Syrian Air Force Intelligence after their jet was shot down in coordination with the Russian naval base in (the Syrian city of) Tartus.”

From: http://english.alarabiya.net/articles/2012/09/29/240805.html

A day prior Al Arabiya alerted their readers they were going to release some classified Syrian military documents. I can't honestly say I was expecting this.

This has the potential to be very bad indeed. If Russia is implicated in the shooting and execution of NATO pilots the implications will be ahh, interesting.

Al Arabiya’s exclusive series on the newly-leaked Syrian security documents continues tomorrow.

Oh great. I can't wait.

Whilst Russian military contracts (c4.5 billion) and their naval base have obviously been a factor in their support of the Assad regime and their refusal to support sanctions (let alone peacekeepers), this really does bring their behaviour into a new light.

(no subject)

Date: 30/9/12 13:51 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com
Yep. If NATO goes to a full-fledged war here, and Russia decides to retaliate.........it's not going to be the happiest few years. OTOH, Russia can't hack the Chechens and Georgia, so I doubt it could even handle Ukraine well nowadays. Either way I hope that this doesn't come to war at all, certainly not to WWIII. Abducting Turkish soldiers seems like these assclowns in Syria want to replay 2006, but as a conventional war. >.<

(no subject)

Date: 2/10/12 01:18 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] meus-ovatio.livejournal.com
This isn't really how NATO works. Anyone who engages in optional extra-territorial projects doesn't get to trigger the alliance clauses.

(no subject)

Date: 2/10/12 01:54 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com
If Russia keeps shooting down Turkish planes, and it really has captured Turkish pilots it might change from an optional extra-territorial product to being the BusinessTM. Of course this still depends on a number of ifs that have to actually happen now when they never did with a much more formidable (militarily speaking) Russia.

(no subject)

Date: 30/9/12 13:48 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] eracerhead.livejournal.com
Documentation "leaked" to the press are notoriously suspect. I'm sure that NATO intelligence agencies across the western world will use their own sources and methods to determine the veracity and provenance of these disclosures and act accordingly.

(no subject)

Date: 1/10/12 00:09 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com
It wouldn't be the first time that Russian soldiers in any fashion shot down or captured NATO soldiers. They did a lot of that in Korea and 'Nam and got away with it, they may be stupid enough to think those rules still apply for the Lethal Joke Russia.

(no subject)

Date: 30/9/12 17:23 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] mahnmut.livejournal.com
D'aw... This gunna end well...
(deleted comment)

(no subject)

Date: 30/9/12 23:23 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] telemann.livejournal.com
take one from Col A, and two from Col B.

(no subject)

Date: 1/10/12 17:54 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sophia-sadek.livejournal.com
Chinese menu bombardment!

(no subject)

Date: 1/10/12 00:08 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com
Depending on how you define ending a war.......

(no subject)

Date: 1/10/12 00:39 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] root-fu.livejournal.com
I'm expecting people to laugh this off like they did every wikileaks disclosure ever.

(no subject)

Date: 1/10/12 06:08 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] mahnmut.livejournal.com
More likely, whoever the whistleblower is, they'll be smeared and proven guilty of all the sins in the world, ergo the things they'll reveal would be rendered moot somehow.

(no subject)

Date: 1/10/12 11:37 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] root-fu.livejournal.com
Probably.

(no subject)

Date: 1/10/12 11:31 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] root-fu.livejournal.com
Wikileaks has disclosed lots of things that are real.

Claims to the contrary have more to do with pompous apathetic types who enable government as a coping mechanism for reality wanting to trivialize & dismiss wikileaks disclosures in the way some religious fundamentalists trivialize scientific evidence suggesting the world isn't 10,000 years old in order to twist reality to their own pre-conceived views than it does anything else.

(no subject)

Date: 1/10/12 17:47 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com
This isn't like the others. This is an act of war, assuming that people decide since Russia can't even handle the motherfucking Chechens without moving Heaven and Earth Cold War rules about letting Russia get a free hand to shoot NATO soldiers whenever it damn well pleases no longer apply. If they do, then it'll be another in the long instances of Russia's 'peace' and 'toleration' in its real-world manifestation. At least it's not 300,000 soldiers maintaining the air defenses this time.

(no subject)

Date: 2/10/12 06:16 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] root-fu.livejournal.com
Things like this have occurred in the past & were largely covered up & ignored.

The truth of the matter is more damage will be inflicted & more casualties will be caused by friendly fire.

If the public doesn't care & there's no public outcry or embarrassment for the fact that it happened, there isn't likely to be anything done as a result.

(no subject)

Date: 2/10/12 12:17 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com
No, they were known at the time. Russia had actual fighter aces in Korea, people who gained their title by KILLING US PILOTS. In Vietnam they were responsible for maintaining Hanoi's air defense and the USSR actually got involved in direct fighting with Israel in the 1970s. If you define knowing this as covering it up, you're defining covering up differently than most people do. Now kindly stick to the topic and don't derail in the next response because you're incapable of responding to a factual assertion with facts.

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