Election year propaganda or serious charge?

[rick-day.livejournal.com]

Please. Before we start, forgive the source. I know it is biased. I state that up front, Kos is, at best, an anti-right alarmist site. How much they get 'right' is up to the perspective of the reader, no doubt.

But funny, I've said the same thing as this article opinion piece for years, that GOP obstructionism on matters of economic malady really borders on treason because they put an amazing amount of partisan hatred for Obama before the good of the country. To hold up critical (yeah, again in the eyes of the beholder) legisation to bully out (or in) social political Pop Tarts™ for those who score well below 20 on the "You Know What".

TBH, I don't want to dig through 3 years of examples of obstructionist bullying. It's all lying there for the rest of you to bicker over. 

My questions is not "will they" hold hearings and find these white males guilty of treason. My question is "By conciously meeting and discussing such strategy, then enacting it, were these congressmen holding true to their oath of office"?


The current oath was enacted in 1884:

I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter: So help me God.

Again, linking sources to stories, studies and the like take a back seat to practical experience in this case. We are all old enough to remember the 2008 election, and what has transpired since. If someone can give me a few solid GOP backed plans that did not involve doing the polar opposite of White House supported legislation (ie: economic stimulus not involving tax cuts for rich), I would sincerely appreciate it.

Comments

[op-tech-glitch.livejournal.com]

I'm no fan of Issa, but for this one he's smack-dab on.

[meus-ovatio.livejournal.com]

He didn't write it silly head.

[rick-day.livejournal.com]

yeah, it was more of a call to Issa. The lack of quotations is the key.

You are not going to ever hear anyone in Congress talk about impeaching anyone except for Barry O.

[meus-ovatio.livejournal.com]

Um, you can't make voting an act of treason. There's that whole common sense thing that jailing representatives for their Constitutionally granted powers is ridiculous. Nor can you charge representatives with anything for whatever they say in Congress.

[meus-ovatio.livejournal.com]

It isn't really an ethical issue. It's just a fact of law and how our government works. Elected representatives are sovereign agents of their constituencies sent to the Congress to do or say or vote however in whatever manner they want. There are no "rules" on "how to be a representative", outside of procedural rules for proceedings in the chamber itself.

Connect the dots

[rick-day.livejournal.com]

Agreed. Legal conspiracy to obstruct economic legislation during recession/depression is not treason; it is a political tactic.

However, there are arguments that the main tool of obstructionism, the filibuster, is unconstitutional. Ergo, etc etc

http://scholarship.law.cornell.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1180&context=facpub

[chessdev.livejournal.com]

You *CAN* make deliberate plots to crash the economy considered an act of treason since there is a specific goal and intent, beyond just "voting" or "not voting".

WILL they do this? Of course not -- what good is the old' boy network if they let THAT happen?

[meus-ovatio.livejournal.com]

No you can't. Representatives are sovereign representatives of their constituencies, and if their constituencies want to crash the economy, that is their full and sovereign right.

[rick-day.livejournal.com]

because it is what it is

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

Treason constitutionally means only levying war against the USA and aiding and adhering to her enemies in that process. The GOP has party discipline and the willingness to use it, that's not treason, that's an illustration of what happens when a competent party works against an incompetent one.

[chessdev.livejournal.com]

You sure some of the things the GOP has tried doesnt count as "war against the USA"? I'm just going by results mind you, not intent... 8-)

[gunslnger.livejournal.com]

Intent is essential.

[jonathankorman.livejournal.com]

Indeed. The haphazard use of the word “treason” in our political rhetoric in the past several years is mortifying. The Framers took time to be explicit about the subject in the Constitution for good reason.

[chessdev.livejournal.com]

The framers probably didnt envision the type of politicking seen today where parties would actually vote
in such a way as to damage, knowingly, their own country...

[rimpala.livejournal.com]

agreed, I may not agree with the GOP on a lot of things but I disagree with political prisoners a whole hell of a lot more.

[dwer.livejournal.com]

Bradly Manning would like a word.

[devil-ad-vocate.livejournal.com]

The GOP hasn't kept their agenda a secret. Their number one priority has been - and is - to get rid of Obama. Neither party listens to the overwhelming opinion of Americans, which is to stop bickering and GOVERN. The never-ending pissing match is of no interest to those who don't have an abiding interest in politics. What qualifies as a pissing match: when Party loyalists vote against measures that their side supported in the recent past, simply because "the other guy" now champions the same stance.

[chessdev.livejournal.com]

The Democrats have *tried* to govern, however with more "NO" and more filibusters from the GOP this session
than all other Congressional sessions *combined* -- it's understandably been a little difficult to get things done.

[muscadinegirl.livejournal.com]

The Republicans did the same thing to Carter. Are those Republicans also traitors?

[mrbogey.livejournal.com]

The Diarist mistitled it. It was meant to be titled, "враг народа".

Kos doesn't realize how big a fans they are of Stalinism. Any action against the party is against the people.

Besides, Issa has his hands full with trying to get Holder to explain why he was selling guns to Mexican cartels and covering up the murders of federal agents.

[chessdev.livejournal.com]

Kos doesn't realize how big a fans they are of Stalinism. Any action against the party is against the people.

In this case, the action against the [Democrat] party WAS directly action against the people. You need to
stop believing your own propaganda and recognize what was actually done here.

They blocked legislation that could have helped people:
* Keep their homes
* Feed their families
* Buy medicine
* Get retraining for new jobs

and they did that NOT under the belief it was good policy but that it was good politics -- that hurting that many
people would work for them in the next election.


But nice attempt to somehow turn an active conspiracy to harm the US economy into a name-slinging
against the people they targetted.

on this, we agree

[rick-day.livejournal.com]

OK, now we all agree the Kos is suspect, keep in mind it is opinion, and not a news article.

And we all agree that your second statement is a classic strawman.

Do you deny the meeting happened?

Given the author does not share your political slant, yet may still have a point, do you disagree with the contention of the author that there was a conscious plan by GOP leadership to oppose anything Obama proposed, even to the detriment of the country?

do you agree that a conversation about a potential intentional strategy to hold the government hostage vastly trumps "guns to Mexican"s in scope?