[identity profile] lafinjack.livejournal.com posting in [community profile] talkpolitics
I love ideals. They're an incredible tool in the process of accomplishing your goals. But at some point your ideals have to intersect with reality, and to me this is the biggest problem libertarianism has. A little is good to cleanse the palate, but a strict libertarian view on all things is veering from idealism into unreality. I came across the following post, and I thought it was an amusing take on the issues I have with big-L libertarians. And so here you go:


Libertarianism in One Lesson


No, this isn't David Bergland's evangelistic text. This is an outsider's view of the precepts of libertarianism. I hope you can laugh at how close this is to real libertarianism!

Introduction

One of the most attractive features of libertarianism is that it is basically a very simple ideology. Maybe even simpler than Marxism, since you don't have to learn foreign words like "proletariat".

This brief outline will give you most of the tools you need to hit the ground running as a freshly indoctrinated libertarian ideologue. Go forth and proselytize!

Philosophy:
  • In the beginning, man dwelt in a state of Nature, until the serpent Government tempted man into Initial Coercion.

  • Government is the Great Satan. All Evil comes from Government, and all Good from the Market, according to the Ayatollah Rand.

  • We must worship the Horatio Alger fantasy that the meritorious few will just happen to have the lucky breaks that make them rich. Libertarians happen to be the meritorious few by ideological correctness. The rest can go hang.

  • Government cannot own things because only individuals can own things. Except for corporations, partnerships, joint ownership, marriage, and anything else we except but government.

  • Parrot these arguments, and you too will be a singular, creative, reasoning individualist.

  • Parents cannot choose a government for their children any more than they can choose language, residence, school, or religion.

  • Taxation is theft because we have a right to squat in the US and benefit from defense, infrastructure, police, courts, etc. without obligation.

  • Magic incantations can overturn society and bring about libertopia. Sovereign citizenry! The 16th Amendment is invalid! States rights!

  • Objectivist/Neo-Tech Advantage #69i: The true measure of fully integrated honesty is whether the sucker has opened his wallet. Thus sayeth the Profit Wallace. Zonpower Rules Nerdspace!

  • The great Zen riddle of libertarianism: minimal government is necessary and unnecessary. The answer is only to be found by individuals.


Government
  • Libertarians invented outrage over government waste, bureaucracy, injustice, etc. Nobody else thinks they are bad, knows they exist, or works to stop them.

  • Enlightenment comes only through repetition of the sacred mantra "Government does not work" according to Guru Browne.

  • Only government is force, no matter how many Indians were killed by settlers to acquire their property, no matter how many blacks were enslaved and sold by private companies, no matter how many heads of union members are broken by private police.

  • Money that government touches spontaneously combusts, destroying the economy. Money retained by individuals grows the economy, even if literally burnt.

  • Private education works, public education doesn't. The publicly educated masses that have grown the modern economies of the past 150 years are an illusion.

  • Market failures, trusts, and oligopolies are lies spread by the evil economists serving the government as described in the "Protocols of the Elders of Statism".

  • Central planning cannot work. Which is why all businesses internally are run like little markets, with no centralized leadership.

  • Paternalism is the worst thing that can be inflicted upon people, as everyone knows that fathers are the most hated and reviled figures in the world.

  • Government is like fire, a dangerous servant and a fearsome master. Therefore, we should avoid it entirely, as we do all forms of combustion.


Regulation
  • The FDA is solely responsible for any death or sickness where it might have prevented treatment by the latest unproven fad.

  • Children, criminals, death cultists, and you all have the same inalienable right to own any weaponry: conventional, chemical, biological, or nuclear.

  • All food, drugs, and medical treatments should be entirely unregulated: every industry should be able to kill 300,000 per year in the US like the tobacco industry.

  • If you don't have a gun, you are not a libertarian. If you do have a gun, why don't you have even more powerful armament?

  • Better to abolish all regulations, consider everything as property, and solve all controversy by civil lawsuit over damages. The US doesn't have enough lawyers, and people who can't afford to invest many thousands of dollars in lawsuits should shut up.


Libertarian Party
  • The Libertarian Party is well on its way to dominating the political landscape, judging from its power base of 100+ elected dogcatchers and other important officials after 25 years of effort.

  • The "Party of Oxymoron": "Individualists unite!"

  • Flip answers are more powerful than the best reasoned arguments, which is why so many libertarians are in important government positions.

  • It's time the new pro-freedom libertarian platform was implemented; child labor, orphanages, sweatshops, poorhouses, company towns, monopolies, trusts, cartels, blacklists, private goons, slumlords, etc.

  • Libertarianism "rules" Internet political debate the same way US Communism "ruled" pamphleteering.

  • No compromise from the "Party of Principle". Justice, happiness, liberty, guns, and other good stuff come only from rigidly adhering to inflexible dogmas.

  • Minimal government is whatever we say it is, and we don't agree.

  • Government is "moving steadily in a libertarian direction" with every change libertarians approve of; no matter if it takes one step forward and two steps backwards.

  • Yes, the symbol of the Libertarian Party is a Big Government Statue. It's not supposed to be funny or ironic!


Political Debate Strategy
  • Count only the benefits of libertarianism, count only the costs of government.

  • Five of a factoid beats a full argument.

  • All historical examples are tainted by statism, except when they favor libertarian claims.

  • Spiritually baptize the deceased as libertarians because they cannot protest the anachronism: Locke, Smith, Paine, Jefferson, Spooner, etc.

  • The most heavily armed libertarian has the biggest dick and thus the best argument.

  • The best multi-party democratic republics should be equated to the worst dictatorships for the purposes of denouncing statism. It's only a matter of degree.

  • Inviolate private property is the only true measure of freedom. Those without property have the freedom to try to acquire it. If they can't, let them find somebody else's property to complain on.

  • Private ownership is the cure for all problems, despite the historical record of privately owned states such as Nazi Germany, Czarist and Stalinist Russia, and Maoist China.

  • Require perfection as the only applicable standard to judge government: libertarianism, being imaginary, cannot be fairly judged to have flaws.

  • Only libertarian economists' Nobel Prizes count: the other economists and Nobel Prize Committee are mistaken.

  • Any exceptional case of private production proves that government ought not to be involved.

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] blue-mangos.livejournal.com - Date: 2/1/12 17:26 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] luvdovz.livejournal.com - Date: 2/1/12 17:33 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] telemann.livejournal.com - Date: 2/1/12 17:39 (UTC) - Expand
(deleted comment)

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] telemann.livejournal.com - Date: 2/1/12 17:56 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] luvdovz.livejournal.com - Date: 2/1/12 18:36 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] telemann.livejournal.com - Date: 2/1/12 19:14 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] sealwhiskers.livejournal.com - Date: 2/1/12 22:52 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] telemann.livejournal.com - Date: 2/1/12 17:36 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] rick-day.livejournal.com - Date: 2/1/12 17:36 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] gunslnger.livejournal.com - Date: 2/1/12 23:05 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

Date: 2/1/12 17:30 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] hardblue.livejournal.com
If you are wealthy and connected with the power-elite, then your only goal is to maintain your position and not to lose any of your wealth to the poor and the suckers. You don't need to achieve more and you don't have to deal with any more reality than that. A comfy closed circle.

(no subject)

Date: 2/1/12 17:39 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] chessdev.livejournal.com
Here's an interesting article that attempts to define Conservatism and its goal:
http://www.takeoverworld.info/conservatism.htm

A little extreme in some spots, but interesting nonetheless...

(no subject)

Date: 2/1/12 18:34 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] jonathankorman.livejournal.com
I've found that article extremely illuminating.

For those skeptical of his model, I offer his comments immediately after 9/11 (http://polaris.gseis.ucla.edu/pagre/war.html), which proved uncannily prophetic.

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com - Date: 2/1/12 19:06 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com - Date: 2/1/12 19:07 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] jonathankorman.livejournal.com - Date: 3/1/12 02:45 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] jonathankorman.livejournal.com - Date: 3/1/12 02:45 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com - Date: 3/1/12 03:29 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] jonathankorman.livejournal.com - Date: 3/1/12 05:30 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com - Date: 3/1/12 16:15 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] jonathankorman.livejournal.com - Date: 3/1/12 16:27 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com - Date: 3/1/12 20:49 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

Date: 2/1/12 17:37 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] jonathankorman.livejournal.com
“Those are only old, simplistic, disproven arguments against what statists naïrely understand to be “libertarianism”. Real libertarianism (http://digbysblog.blogspot.com/2011/12/no-true-libertarianism-fallacy.html) is much more sophisticated than you are making it sound. I've read books!”
In its own way, the “No True Libertarianism” argument is very similar to the “No True Communism” of those on the far left, who argue that the fault of Communism lies not with the idea, but with the practice--despite the fact that no successful large-scale Communism has ever been implemented in the world. Neither ideology can fail its adherents. They can only be failed by imperfect practitioners.

(no subject)

Date: 2/1/12 17:38 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] jonathankorman.livejournal.com
naïvely

The loss of Preview on LJ is gonna make me look like an illiterate.

(no subject)

Date: 2/1/12 17:42 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] telemann.livejournal.com
D00d, someone that cares enough to insert umlauts, is no illiterate ;)

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] jonathankorman.livejournal.com - Date: 2/1/12 18:28 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] pastorlenny.livejournal.com - Date: 2/1/12 18:45 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] telemann.livejournal.com - Date: 2/1/12 18:57 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

Date: 2/1/12 18:31 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com
Ironically this OP itself includes an example of said No True Communism arguments by calling Stalin's USSR and Mao's China privately owned states. Comrade O'Brien couldn't have done that better.
From: [identity profile] rick-day.livejournal.com
So here we have someone with no opinion posting someone else's 'opinion'.

You are quite the little stereotyper, ain't ya?

We don't vote for political parties here, we vote for individuals who run for office. Each are judged based on their individual merit.

This is why chessdev didn't post this here. He understood that those issues are scattered, and not ALL the EXCLUSIVE view point of Liberty Loving Americans.

(no subject)

Date: 2/1/12 17:51 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] chessdev.livejournal.com
We don't vote for political parties here, we vote for individuals who run for office.
Here we must disagree. There are quite a few people who will vote because of party
regardless of who is running.

Each are judged based on their individual merit
Again - gotta disagree with you here.

Just the GOP Primaries this year alone disprove that...

depends on the definition of 'we'

Date: 2/1/12 18:12 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] rick-day.livejournal.com
Well I meant the collective 'we' of this community, not the populous in general.

Example: I voted for O, even though I disagreed with the Democrats on direction.

Today I am looking to put that vote somewhere where it will do what I thought it would do with voting for O.

And there is probably a fair share of people in this community who may agree with this tenet.

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] chessdev.livejournal.com - Date: 2/1/12 18:21 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] rick-day.livejournal.com - Date: 3/1/12 01:02 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] chessdev.livejournal.com - Date: 3/1/12 01:05 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

Date: 2/1/12 17:41 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] chessdev.livejournal.com
I like it! I'm curious what some of the "regulars" here will say about this...

(no subject)

Date: 2/1/12 17:51 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] telemann.livejournal.com
Well, if you're really expecting "You know, this post convinced me! By golly, I'm throwing out my most ingrained and intimately personal political viewpoints based this on this post."

Ain't gunna happen.

Issues will be raised with the basic premise(s) and why they're wrong and so not like Libertarianism. That's my prediction.

Image

(no subject)

Date: 2/1/12 17:53 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] chessdev.livejournal.com
Love the pic! and yeah, you're right of course.

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] telemann.livejournal.com - Date: 2/1/12 18:02 (UTC) - Expand

your blog

Date: 2/1/12 18:14 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] rick-day.livejournal.com
did you get this from here or did he get it from you?

(no subject)

Date: 2/1/12 18:18 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] chessdev.livejournal.com
Would it matter?

And why do you bring it up HERE? You keep dragging *me*
into this but *I* wasnt the one who posted it here.

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] rick-day.livejournal.com - Date: 3/1/12 01:01 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

Date: 3/1/12 20:34 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] nairiporter.livejournal.com
You also visit regularly. :-)

(no subject)

Date: 3/1/12 21:37 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] chessdev.livejournal.com
I think if I had a free-day to wander the archives, I could almost point-by-point
validate the post just from some of the "regulars" on the forum.

I've just been waiting to see which ones want to argue "that's not true!" when
several years of their own posts pretty much would back it up.


But that's just the cynic in me smiling

(no subject)

Date: 2/1/12 18:30 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] underlankers.livejournal.com
Sigh, to repeat my previous criticism of the older post, there's no means even in satire to claim that Stalin's Soviet Union and Mao's China were privately owned states. Especially the Stalinist USSR which did its purges to forestall someone building the kind of states within a state that characterized Tsarism and Nazsm.

(no subject)

Date: 2/1/12 18:52 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] mrbogey.livejournal.com
1. Create strawman.

2. Wait for those targeted by strawman to complain.

3. cite no true scotman.

Credits & Style Info

Talk Politics.

A place to discuss politics without egomaniacal mods


MONTHLY TOPIC:

Failed States

DAILY QUOTE:
"Someone's selling Greenland now?" (asthfghl)
"Yes get your bids in quick!" (oportet)
"Let me get my Bid Coins and I'll be there in a minute." (asthfghl)

June 2025

M T W T F S S
       1
2 34 5 678
910 1112131415
16171819202122
23242526272829
30