Israel returns to its roots:

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/middleeast/2011/12/2011122793851983193.html

It's good to see that a country founded by a bunch of secular socialist nationalists hasn't forgotten where it came from. These Haredi will be a disaster for Israel, let alone for Israeli Arabs and Palestinians, if left to run unchecked. Their actions of demanding gender segregation to the point of photoshopping women from photographs and throwing acid in women's faces should not and do not pass unchallenged. Unlike in Palestinian territory where this kind of thing usually makes one a walking target for whichever asshole happens to have the biggest stick at the time, the Israelis can and do protest fairly for their national tradition.

As someone who is invariably unsympathetic to any bunch of medieval holdouts who want to party like it's 1099, I think that this is something we should all agree is a good thing. Is there anyone in this community who will defend what these Haredim are doing and consider to be good things?

Comments

[kardashev.livejournal.com]

"Is there anyone in this community who will defend what these Haredim are doing and consider to be good things?"

lol fuck no. This is a no-brainer. You didn't really give us much to discuss with this post, 'lankers.

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

You never can tell. Besides, it's Bash a Country month, so why not a Bash Fundies Thread?

[fizzyland.livejournal.com]

It should always be a Bash Fundies thread - until their medieval nonsense stops.

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

That's an insult to Medievals, at least the ones that hated the overmighty clerics were as secular as any Europeans in the history of Europe. ;P

[fizzyland.livejournal.com]

I stand corrected. Should have gone with my original comment, something along the lines of: Religion. It does so much good in the world.

[kardashev.livejournal.com]

Point taken.

[dukexmachismo.livejournal.com]

With any luck, someone will accuse him of anti-Semitism. That's always good for a page or two of lulz enlightening dialogue.

[paedraggaidin.livejournal.com]

"Is there anyone in this community who will defend what these Haredim are doing and consider to be good things?"

Hell no. They're as evil as Hamas, the Iranian regime, or any other group of violent theocrats.

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

IIRC both of those have had some defense here.

[fizzyland.livejournal.com]

If you can show some pro sexual-harassment comments related to those groups, I have a shiny two-bit piece for ya.

[allhatnocattle.livejournal.com]

No, he probably can't. But I'll be glad to give you one, cupcake.

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

Sheesh, it would cost me 6 bucks (round trip) in gas to come and collect...

Seriously, I doubt that I can, and I'm not really interested in doing so. My comment was more a general irritant to the anti- Israel, pro-Iranian and pro-Hamas (as when compared to Israel) that pop up quite frequently on this forum.

[fizzyland.livejournal.com]

As someone who just got into a debate about Iran, hell that could have been me. Now, in no way do I support the Iranian regime, which is broadly hated and distrusted with cause. But it's pure stupidity to claim that all the problems with U.S./Iran relations are because of the mullahs/Iranians chanting. We have a long and poor history with screwing up that country.

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

It's a good thing I didn't claim that them, I may be ignorant, but I hate being thought of as stupid ;)

[mahnmut.livejournal.com]

Go outside "This-Forum"(tm) for a while and observe the world of teh Internetz. It'll provide you a perspective. ;-)

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

If I really cared about perspective I probably wouldn't be on teh internetz at all :P LOL

[mahnmut.livejournal.com]

I bet you've learned more new things on the internets than on all the radio talkshows combined, just saying.

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

And with probably as much fact behind them ;)

[mahnmut.livejournal.com]

We try really hard. ;-)

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

I think a major problem with Israel-Palestine discussions is the assumption that if one notes Israel is imperfect this implies Palestinian leadership is in itself good. Given that Palestinian leaders on the whole have killed more Palestinians than any of them ever did Israelis, I don't think anyone who actually is concerned with the Palestinian *people* would find the leaders of said people worthy of respect or admiration. Hamas is simply a continuation of all that's wrong with the political "leadership."

TL;DR: One can be pro-Palestinian but anti-Abbas and anti-Hamas. One can also be despising the extremists of both sides and recognizing the legitimacy of *both sides* In practice this tends to be picking one and defending it warts and all, albeit.

[paedraggaidin.livejournal.com]

Well, never from Station Little Rock!

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

I'm sure I didn't mean you :)

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

How many of the people that defended them are still regular commenters here? Just curious.

[geezer-also.livejournal.com]

We just had a whole post on why the Iranians should have nuclear weapons.
And it wasn't that long ago that several people were in essence justifying the rocket attacks from Gaza into Israel, something about disproportionate retaliation. I think I remember who that was but he had a number of supporters, whom I think I remember, that are all still around.

Dude, at my age I can barely remember who I'm not talking to, no way I can remember why ;).

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

Eh, Hamas is one of the continuations of the greatest defect in Palestinian politics: too incompetent for actual political leadership, too murderous for any opposition to last in itself. People that do justify those rockets and call themselves pro-Palestinian miss that all Hamas does here is give Israel greater excuses to do what it will anyway because it has nukes and tanks and Palestine does not.

[mahnmut.livejournal.com]

Is there anyone in this community who will defend what these Haredim are doing

And what if there isn't? Wank commence? ;-)

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

If there isn't then it's a sign that people really do have standards. ;P

[mahnmut.livejournal.com]

Most do. But you wouldn't like some of their standards. :-P

[allhatnocattle.livejournal.com]

Are you talking about this (http://www.aljazeera.com/news/middleeast/2011/12/2011122793851983193.html)

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

Yes I am.