Religion and the death penalty.

[futurebird.livejournal.com]

I'm pretty religious and also pretty liberal (in the American sense of the word) I became liberal (I used to be a Libertarian when I was younger) gradually as I've gotten older and generally been impressed with how well liberal institutions work. I regard politics as more practical than moral and don't think I have any right to have my own religious notions of morality enforced on others. Like many liberals, I object to the death penalty because if its long history of racist, classist and anti-male** application and its inherent imperfections (a single innocent being executed invalidates the whole institution.)

But, unlike other political positions I have, my disdain for the death penalty coincides with my religious beliefs on the matter. Mainly, that God's justice is perfect, God will send the sinners to hell and the righteous to heaven and it's not really possible for us, as mere mortals, to tell which is which. As such, justice as in retribution is a matter for God. We would do best to respect life and ensure our safety by locking up people who hurt others.

Yet I find that many people who are religious have no problem with the death penalty-- since religion tends to intersect of conservative politics more often. Or is there a religious connection there as well?

• Roman Catholic Church says that the death penalty is "lawful slaying" and basis this on it being a necessary deterrent and prevention method, but not as a means of vengeance. So, if it is ineffective as a deterrent (there is some evidence that this is true) --would they reject it? Recently they have though not very vocally.
• Anglican and Episcopalian bishops condemned the death penalty.
• Southern Baptist Convention updated Baptist Faith and Message. In it the convention officially sanctioned the use of capital punishment by the State. It said that it is the duty of the state to execute those guilty of murder and that God established capital punishment in the Noahic Covenant. This is different from the Roman Catholic take on it-- no mention of it excluding vengeance.
• Other Baptists reject the death penalty, my church does!
• Like Christians, Islam and Buddhists and Jews do not have a united stance on the matter.
• Atheists also have many views on the matter.

So, based on all of that, do we find no guidance in religion? I wonder how I would feel about the matter if the religious teachings I have encountered didn't match with my philosophical notions-- Is it always the case that one must shape the other? Is there anyone who thinks the death penalty should be allowed, though they suppose it is sinful or against their religion? Is there anyone who wants to stop the death penalty though they think it might not be a sin?


**We could talk about how believing it is wrong to kill a woman still further dehumanizes her-- the global effect of this furthesr sexism against women, the local effect is unfair to poor, mostly minority, men.

Comments

[pastorlenny.livejournal.com]

It's a simple question. I'm not sure what makes it "combative" -- or why it would be less "combative" to present basic Christian soteriology.

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

Cool story bro. If you think she was wrong, say why. Don't just go 'nuh huh'.

[pastorlenny.livejournal.com]

I think I've done this at some length in the thread. Those comments include specific scripture references and questions about specific bits of doctrine. So I'm not sure why you're being combative.

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

Interesting considering you still avoided answering my question clarifying your statement when I directly asked you. How about we stick with that for the sake of the discussion and drop the meta for now.

[pastorlenny.livejournal.com]

I think I've invested plenty of time in this -- and my primary interest was in correcting the bad theology of a professing Christian. If you review the threads and still have a question for me, I'll do my besst to answer it. But I think you'll find that I found the OP's assertino problematic in several ways -- including the absence of both mercy of God and the atoning death of the Christ from a description of how people "get sent to heaven" (which is itself a problematic formulation).

[the-rukh.livejournal.com]

including the absence of both mercy of God and the atoning death of the Christ from a description of how people "get sent to heaven" (which is itself a problematic formulation).

See, that's all you needed to say. No need to go all flamey.

[pastorlenny.livejournal.com]

I'm not sure what you're referring to when you say "all flamey" -- but, as I hope I made clear in one of my later comments, there is a reason to not simply reply to the OP's assertion with "I think your formulation is wrong because it misattributes salvation to God's justice instead of His mercy, and it leaves out the central role of the cross."

But I am glad that I was at least able to answer your question. :)