Why is this Information Not Offered?

[paft.livejournal.com]

Back in July, I posted a video a woman took while trying to get her son a voting ID in Wisconsin. At the time what I emphasized was the fact that the DMV apparently considered “bank activity” a requirement for voting. But there was more to the conversation. Given information that’s recently linked about about DMV employees being instructed NOT to offer certain information, it’s worth seeing again. The pertinent part of the conversation begins at about the 4.30 mark:

Woman: If someone were to just say thet needed a state ID card, would they know it was free, if it was for voting?

Man at DMV: Uhhh, unless they tell us it was for voting, we charge ‘em. Cause it’s….

Woman: Why is that, because with the new law, the Voter ID bill…

Man at DMV: It’s going to discourage them.

Woman: They’re…It’s supposed to be free.

Man at DMV: If it’s for…

Woman: So why wouldn’t you tell them that, right from the start, “Voter ID is free.”

Man at DMV: They’re the same card, so, unless you come in and specifically request it, we charge you for it. Like, let’s say you’re 20 and you’re going on a trip. You may not vote, so we’re still going to charge them for that card.

Woman: But would you ask them? Would you say “is this for voting, or…

Man at DMV: If they check the box, so…um, it’s, you know, one of them where… They shouldn’t even be doing any of it, but it’s one of them where they wanted to make this law, and now it’s going to affect a lot of people, so if it’s for voting, we do it for free, but we don’t know that they’re going to use it for voting.

Woman: Why don’t you have that as a, you know, I would like to ask your supervisor, why don’t you ask people, “Is this for voting? Is this ID for voting or is it for something else?”

Man at DMV: They put it on here and that satisifies the state statute so, um you know I can’t really answer that question.

Woman: I would like to ask your supervisor that question.

Man at DMV: Okay, I’ll go get him...

Supervisor: They need to ask for it. It’s something that is available but they should ask for it.

Woman: But why not ask them, “Is this a voter ID card or a regular ID card?”

Supervisor: Because… the, the, pol… (seems at a loss)

Woman: I mean, have you been given instructions?

Supervisor: Yeah, the problem, the instruction is that if someone comes in and says “I need an ID card to go and vote,” that it’s free. If it is an original issuance or a renewal. But if someone comes in and they’ve lost their ID, it’s not within its renewal period and they need a replacement, then we have to charge for it. So a replacement, a duplicate...

Woman: But couldn’t you ask them, “Is this a renewal or a replacement or is this for a Voter ID?"

Supervisor: Our instruction is to let them ask.

Woman: And so who gave you that direction?

Supervisor: Well, it’s from the powers-that-be.

Woman: Who would that be?

Supervisor: Well, that would be, the next step in my chain of command would be Tracy Howard…

In fact, it was recently revealed that the instructions came from a top Department of Transportation official Steve Kreaiser:

While you should certainly help customers who come in asking for a free ID to check the appropriate box, you should refrain from offering the free version to customers who do not ask for it.

If the DMV officials in the video seem a wee bit ambivalent to you, it’s probably not your imagination. Recently a Wisconsin state employee was fired for sending out an email calling people so spread the word about the free IDs.

An interview with the employee can be heard here.

Whether or not the employee was wise to do what he did, this raises questions about the motives behind this voter ID law. Why would specific instructions go out for DMV officials not to offer information that would prevent applicants from essentially paying for the right to vote?

Crossposted from Thoughtcrimes

Comments

[peristaltor.livejournal.com]

Exactly. It's a creep toward the Authoritarian side of the spectrum.

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

And a return to US traditions that are best left in the history books.

[mrbogey.livejournal.com]

Not explaining to people they can get a free ID for voting purposes is a step toward authoritarianism but forced collectivization isn't.

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

When has the USA turned into the USSR of Josef Stalin? Give specific examples or I'll be delighted to regale people with what collectivization really was.

[mrbogey.livejournal.com]

Remember, if it's not 100% then it's 0%.

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

If we're bringing Josef Stalin up it had damn well better be 100%. The man was only different from Hitler in not having death camps, if we bring him up there had better be a damned good reason.

[mrbogey.livejournal.com]

You brought up Joseph Stalin.

[peristaltor.livejournal.com]

And you brought up collectivism, invoking the best known of the collectivists.

Still, once again, authoritarianism and collectivism are on different spectra. The best representation I've seen goes something like:

Authoritarianism
|
|
Collectivism —— —— Corporatism
|
|
Anarchism

I'm not sure that will print out well, but whatever.

[mrbogey.livejournal.com]

'And you brought up collectivism, invoking the best known of the collectivists.'

Well then clearly we're talking about Hitler since Authoritarianism was brought up and Wisconsin isn't WW2 Germany.

Forced collectivism falls squarely in the authoritarian camp.

[peristaltor.livejournal.com]

Again, forced need not be Authoritarian. Anarchic collectives can used social pressures not dictated by hierarchical leaders to enforce social norms.

[mrbogey.livejournal.com]

Nobody forced you to join an anarchist commune.

Gov't doesn't use societal pressure when it's passing mandates with jail as the penalty.

[peristaltor.livejournal.com]

Sure it does. Jail is society's way of sequestering from itself those elements it deems (for whatever reason) worthy of separation.

Jails need not be led by totalitarians. If enough of the group decides it's time for Johnny to take a time-out, that works.

[mrbogey.livejournal.com]

'Jail is society's way of sequestering from itself those elements it deems (for whatever reason) worthy of separation.'

So we should lock up anyone who is a harmful element of society? I agree. Start with the collectivists who want to force everyone.

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

Nobody's doing forced collectivization in the United States. FFS, Joe Stalin's dictatorship and the Obama Administration are completely different things.

[mrbogey.livejournal.com]

Oh FFS, Governor Walker and Hitler are two different guys so stop comparing them!!!!

See how that works?

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

As I recall I'm one of the ones who points out those obvious differences so fuck off with saying I say something I do not. Unless you've a clear and present noting of my posts on the matter, which include that whole "nobody in the USA seriously advocates exterminating Slavs and Jews to create Grossdeutschland ober das Welt" post then kindly stop arguing this with me and argue it with people like Paft who do think that Walker and Hitler are the same.

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

No, you did, when you said that forced collectivization is not a step toward authoritarianism. Unless you didn't realize that was that rotten old bank robber's idea of how to electrify Russia and I have ore respect for what you know and do not know to think that.

[mrbogey.livejournal.com]

'No, you did, when you said that forced collectivization is not a step toward authoritarianism.'

Well what do you call collectivism when it's forced?

[peristaltor.livejournal.com]

Authoritarianism can dictate collectivism, as Stalin did. Anarchic collectives can also exist, like some Kibbutzim (sp?). There are no leaders in anarchic collectives.

Most governments fall somewhere in between. In our democracy, the forced part is enforced by the will of the electorate, which is ideally anarchic.

You seem obsessed by the "forced" aspect of societal definition. It need not be. For example, should you enter a business and demand something the business owner not care to provide, in an anarchic collective the owner would simply stand mute while you rant yourself silly. Others would ignore you and hope you leave. If you stay and continue to rant, yes, there might be some forcing of the ranter to get the hell out. But at no time need a "leader" come to force your compliance.

Which brings up an interesting philosophical point: Why shouldn't a collective of individuals be able to establish a code of social behavior should they so choose?

[mrbogey.livejournal.com]

'Which brings up an interesting philosophical point: Why shouldn't a collective of individuals be able to establish a code of social behavior should they so choose?'

on individuals who willingly join the group or on ones who can't leave? Because people can leave a Kibbutz. People can leave communes. The issue of leaving the US is settled.

Saying it's fine and dandy to force rules on people is a perfectly fine way to justify slavery.

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

Which libertarians have done. The founders of the Confederacy were libertarians to the point of view they sabotaged their own state rather than ideologically compromise. There's a reason libertarians rush to wave the St. Andrews Cross and proclaim that slavery is freedom.

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

Forced collectivization does not exist in the United States so the question is meaningless.

[mrbogey.livejournal.com]

Oh cool so I can not pay SS and Medicare taxes. I don't have to buy insurance nor do I have to participate in anything that I do not wish to participate in.

[peristaltor.livejournal.com]

You might be hung up on nuance, I don't know. There seems to me to be an enormous gulf between being required to pay a portion of your earnings to support SS, etc., and being slapped in chains, branded and bought and sold as a piece of property.

You can avoid these things by not participating in the money economy. Grow y our own food, secure in the knowledge that when you eat it, it won't be taxed! As a bus driver, I occasionally come across people living of the grid, as it were, bumming a ride from one camp to the next. It's doable.

[underlankers.livejournal.com]

If civilization is forced collectivism you're always welcome to go be a caveman.