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talkpolitics2010-04-21 06:23 pm
green-man-2010.livejournal.com) wrote in talkpolitics2010-04-21 06:23 pm
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International Week - a fairer deal for the developing world.
Ok dudes, sorry to post on the wrong topic last time - so here's myr take on the international situation for International Week.
A lot of Brits are up in arms about immigration. i was on the doorstep this morning, canvassing for the Greens when a man points out to me that 5 houses in his street were sold recently - and only one went to an English family. he said it like this was some sort of problem, and confirmed it with a rant about foreigners.
Now, it caused a stir in the 50s when we suddenly have a boatload of Afro Carribean people turn up in England on the boat The Windrush .
These men were invited over by the government - basically to do the jobs the white people did not want. we also got lots of nurses coming over from abroad. this meant that the countries they came from were suddenly short of nurses, but what the hell - we were brits and we could pay them more than their own country.
But what really kicked things off was the expulsoin of many middle class Asians ( Indians and pakistanis ) from Uganda. As they were Commonwealth citizens, the Uk too them in. And then we had the Somalis...
So now, we have had wave after wave of refugees settling in the UK. In some areas, the local white population is outnumbered, but immigration of this nature is mainly in the cities. go to the smaller towns and the rural areas of the Uk , and the population is mainly white, but in some areas, racial tension is high because he white people resent being in a minority on the streets and in the schools.
But why do people come to the UK anyway? The fact that we run a Welfare state is only part of the answer. look at what goes on in Somalia, and you see a complete breakdown in law and order. make no mistake, civil war, poverrty and extreme conditions lead many to flee their country of origin and settle elsewhere.
If you open the kitchen door and find the sink overflowing, there is no point grabbing a mop, or trying to bail out with a bucket. it makes more sense to turn off the tap first of all. Rather than invest in Border police and vote for tougher legislation on immigration, the Greens argue that the causes of ecological and economic disasters abroad should be addressed as a matter of urgency.
Britain , like many countires, sells arms abroad. In fact it is a principle export. rather than making the world a safer place, it fills the world with refugees fleeing the conflicts that rage in their native lands. Our rampant consumerism is also pushing poorer nations deeper into poverty.
Sweat shop labour in the far east means that tee shirts are cheap on the UK high street, but that poor people get little reward for their hard work in their own country. this also spurs many to smuggle themselves into the UK.
So, Greens say that international treaties that protect workers rights and limit the deadly arms trade are the only effective ways to limit the supply of illegal immigrants. The Berlin Wall did not keep people fleeing to the west, and the Border Police will not keep out the refugees who continue to flee the developing world and the problems they face there.
On the other hand, if we fix those problems, in the long term , this will mean fewer illegal immigrants. So, we advocate -
Support for democratic movements and Trade Union rights for workers in places where they have not got them.
A limiit on arms exports
A change in the way that muultinationals are allowed to operate in developing nations, and trade rules that alllow local economies to grow instead of being exploited.
Implementing the Tobin Tax - preventing greedy speculators from exploiting weaker currencies.
The better we can make life for people in Somalia and places like it, the less we will be concerned with migrants sneaking through our borders, the less we will hear of piracy off the coast of West Africa, and the less we will see of racial tension in our societies.
A lot of Brits are up in arms about immigration. i was on the doorstep this morning, canvassing for the Greens when a man points out to me that 5 houses in his street were sold recently - and only one went to an English family. he said it like this was some sort of problem, and confirmed it with a rant about foreigners.
Now, it caused a stir in the 50s when we suddenly have a boatload of Afro Carribean people turn up in England on the boat The Windrush .
These men were invited over by the government - basically to do the jobs the white people did not want. we also got lots of nurses coming over from abroad. this meant that the countries they came from were suddenly short of nurses, but what the hell - we were brits and we could pay them more than their own country.
But what really kicked things off was the expulsoin of many middle class Asians ( Indians and pakistanis ) from Uganda. As they were Commonwealth citizens, the Uk too them in. And then we had the Somalis...
So now, we have had wave after wave of refugees settling in the UK. In some areas, the local white population is outnumbered, but immigration of this nature is mainly in the cities. go to the smaller towns and the rural areas of the Uk , and the population is mainly white, but in some areas, racial tension is high because he white people resent being in a minority on the streets and in the schools.
But why do people come to the UK anyway? The fact that we run a Welfare state is only part of the answer. look at what goes on in Somalia, and you see a complete breakdown in law and order. make no mistake, civil war, poverrty and extreme conditions lead many to flee their country of origin and settle elsewhere.
If you open the kitchen door and find the sink overflowing, there is no point grabbing a mop, or trying to bail out with a bucket. it makes more sense to turn off the tap first of all. Rather than invest in Border police and vote for tougher legislation on immigration, the Greens argue that the causes of ecological and economic disasters abroad should be addressed as a matter of urgency.
Britain , like many countires, sells arms abroad. In fact it is a principle export. rather than making the world a safer place, it fills the world with refugees fleeing the conflicts that rage in their native lands. Our rampant consumerism is also pushing poorer nations deeper into poverty.
Sweat shop labour in the far east means that tee shirts are cheap on the UK high street, but that poor people get little reward for their hard work in their own country. this also spurs many to smuggle themselves into the UK.
So, Greens say that international treaties that protect workers rights and limit the deadly arms trade are the only effective ways to limit the supply of illegal immigrants. The Berlin Wall did not keep people fleeing to the west, and the Border Police will not keep out the refugees who continue to flee the developing world and the problems they face there.
On the other hand, if we fix those problems, in the long term , this will mean fewer illegal immigrants. So, we advocate -
Support for democratic movements and Trade Union rights for workers in places where they have not got them.
A limiit on arms exports
A change in the way that muultinationals are allowed to operate in developing nations, and trade rules that alllow local economies to grow instead of being exploited.
Implementing the Tobin Tax - preventing greedy speculators from exploiting weaker currencies.
The better we can make life for people in Somalia and places like it, the less we will be concerned with migrants sneaking through our borders, the less we will hear of piracy off the coast of West Africa, and the less we will see of racial tension in our societies.
no subject
I'm going to assume you live in an area that does not have a large illegal problem, by the typical arguments you have.
Most illegals do not pay all the taxes they should. A very large percentage of illegals in So Cal work under the table and pay no taxes at all. Many who pay into the system they never claim is because they are using someone else's SS#. This causes some interesting problems if it's a valid #. I could tell you an interesting anecdote about one of my employees who was paying excess taxes for several years, and didn't find out until his wife died and the IRS came after him for back taxes on income from whoever was using her card. It took 3 years to straighten the whole thing out. I understand this happens frequently. This is where all that unclaimed money is from.
My understanding is that money from the U.S. is Mexico's 2nd or 3rd largest source of income (not all is from illegals. I have heard (not substantuated, because the figures some how vary depending on where they come from (something about lies and statistics ;D) that the actual cost (to the state) of the illegals is any where from 0 to 10 billion, I have never read or heard anyone claim dollar wise they are a net benefit. The supposed benefit is that they do jobs "white folks" won't do. Of course they also do a lot of jobs "white folks" would love to do. There are at least 3 construction trades that they are more than half (including mine so I admit to a bias).
"illegal status is, after all, controlled by the host society"
This is really too simplistic, especially in a "sanctuary city".
Personally I'm a firm believer in fines for employers, rather than oh, say just legalizing everyone.
There is a lot more I can say, but I'm actually ranting, and some of it should be addressed to your original comment in a more calm manner. However I have promised my grand-daughter she could use my computer. So I need to go, and may not be back for a while.